I've had J.C. Taylor for about 45 years, never a problem but really I think you can only judge on the basis of having claims, and how they were handled. I had one, about 44 years ago, stolen radiator mascot. The paid instantly for a replacement, and covered all phone and shipping costs. That's not a lot experience to base a recommendation on, but I've never seen a reason to change.

I believe the reason is simply that Packard hadn't adopted the trademark "Thunderbolt" until 1953. But the engines, within the same displacement, only differed in marginal details over the years other than changes in carburetion on some (4 bbl).

I'm in complete agreement guys, this whole 12 volt conversion thing just baffles me with the exception of the wife who demands AC. Also, when people say they convert so it will turn over faster, who gives a s..t how fast it turns over, what matters is how fast it starts. With a good battery and cables and starter, it turns over at the speed it was designed to turn over!

I'm not sure how familiar you are with these cars, so let me ramble on a bit and hope it's useful to you. The number on the frame is just that, a frame #, ditto for the steering gear, Packard continued doing this for about another 10 years and all those numbers should be within the same range as the engine #s for that year and series, and the engine# should be the same as the VN number. As they are within the range for a 2nd Series (1925-26) Eight, I'd view that as pretty conclusive. The fact that your car is near the end of the number range strongly suggests that it was built and sold in 1926, though as I've said Packard didn't adhere to calendar year introduction until some years later so I suppose one could call it either a 1925 or a 1926, but the definitive identification is 2nd Series Eight. It also wasn't until a few years later that the VN also was encoded to give year/chassis/body type. Your engine # may be on the driver side, on the aluminum lower crankcase, in the vicinity of the oil filler tube and near the junction of the upper (cast iron) cylinder bores and it should be the same as the VN. Please also measure the wheelbase, should be 143 inches. The only other wheelbase available in the 2nd Series Eight was 136 inches, and there were no 7-passenger body styles available on that chassis. FYI there were 5680 2nd Series Eight produced. If we're correct about the Series and the wheelbase is 143 inches, the proper description of your car would be a Packard Model 2-43 with body style 254 (sedan for 7 pass, no divider window) or 256 (limousine for 7 pass).

Bore and stroke are 3-3/8 x 5, 84 brake horsepower. The 2nd Series started with a multiple disc clutch which was discontinued part-way thru the series, in April 1926. Likewise the later cars had only 30 chassis points lubricated by the Bijur system, as compared to 45 at introduction. These were changes made during the series production. Rear axle ratio 4.66.

I have a friend, a professional restorer who has done numerous Pebble Beach cars, who has 2 Second Series Eights, a Merrimac coupe and a Murphy disappearing top convertible. Both are quite original and the Merrimac was driven last year from Seattle to Pebble Beach, probably over 1000 miles, w/o incident. Send me a PM if you want his contact information. And best of luck with the car, it's quite a wonderful piece of history.

EDIT- I should have pointed out that there were 8 body styles on 2-36 chassis and 4 on the 2-43 chassis, and of course naked chassis sold to coachbuilders as well.

In that era Packard didn't build and market by calendar year but by series, some longer and some shorter than a year. I'm guessing that it's a 2nd series (Feb 1925 to Aug 1926) Eight, body style #256. If so, the engine# should be between 209,000 and 219,999. This would be the first series with the Bijur chassis oiler and Bendix 3-shoe internal expanding brakes. It also would then have the early-style crankshaft which gave rise to the odd firing order (cast into the right rear of the crankcase), the firing order was revised to the almost universal 1-6-2-5-8-3-7-4 beginning with the next series.

Owen: The 1933 Pierce-Arrow's had a new front and rear design. They went to what I call a skirted fron fender design.


John, that pale green 1933 Pierce Arrow V12 convertible sedan you show with blackwall tires under the RM Logo is actually a LeBaron, one of allegedly only 3 on the shorter (model 1242) wheelbase, and has an ostrich skin interior. It was owned for a time by Mr. George Couri of Tenafly New Jersey and did the Concours circuit a few years back. It has been suggested that it was originally owned by Carole Lombard though as far as I've heard there was no substantiation of that.

The P-A 1242 and 1247 were 3-1/2 x 4 bore and stroke for 462 cubic inches. The model 1236 was 3-3/8 x 4 for 429 cubic inches

Using the Automobile Quarterly of 1968, it first appears that you've got to specify which model in which year when looking at bumpers. For example a 1932 Model 54 has a one-piece front bumper, but the 1932 Twelve Model 1247 has a two-piece. I believe all 1934 and up have l-piece regardless of which chassis. 1930 Model B has a two-piece as the 1931 Model 43.

Using Bernie Weiss' wonderful little P-A book (republished in 1981) shows 1933 Twelves with both 1- and 2-piece front bumpers, a 1932 Pierce 8 with a 1-piece, and a variety of 1931s all with 2-piece except for a Waterhouse close-coupled sedan. Of course custom-bodied cars could always be the exception and pictures of them don't help understanding what was factory equipment. A 1929 has a l-piece and the Series 80 and 81 (lesser Pierce Arrows if there is such a thing) have a variety as well.

I suspect the answer is, you can't identify the year and model of P-A by the front bumper alone. Pierce being what they were (absolutely wonderful cars), you could probably have asked for a snow plow instead of a bumper and gotten it.

I haven't checked Ralston's P-A book but may take a look later.

I guess I don't understand this picture, isn't it the same one we already saw and commented on?

1931 Pierce Arrow Model 43's also have the two-piece bumpers which was why I couldn't tell if it was 31 or earlier. Here's a pic of an entirely original and unrestored or molested 1931 Model 43.

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That Pierce Arrow is not a 1933, it's a 1931 or older.