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Board index » All Posts (Lex)




Re: 26th, 55th, and 56th Series Starter Compatibility?
#11
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Update: Ross has answered this question in another thread. Mods, feel free to delete this thread.

Posted on: 2016/7/25 12:03
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Re: Fuel sender & 12V conversion on a 1953 Clipper.
#12
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Quote:

If you go to Ebay motors and search "Packard 12v mini starter" you will find a unit already modified to fit. He only lists it for 49-51 but I know they will for certain fit 48 to 54, and probably back to 35 juniors.

Ross, you just answered a question I created a fresh thread for. Maybe my millenial obsession with immediacy needs some work. Found that starter a while back, but haven't been able to confirm 26th series fitment until now. Are you using one?

Posted on: 2016/7/25 12:01
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26th, 55th, and 56th Series Starter Compatibility?
#13
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Still running through 12V starter options for my 26th series 288ci I8 Clipper. There's a seller on eBay making starters with indexable flanges/noses for 55th and 56th series cars, and I'm wondering if the 26th series uses the same mounting flange, gear pitch, throw, etc. The starter assembly and case part numbers listed in the literature section do not match between 26th, 55th, and 56th series, which is a bad start. But I'm hoping the gents at Kanter, or someone else familiar with multiple series, can confirm similarities or differences between the starter flanges, gears, and rings. I have good measurement of the 26th series flange and nose, and can get them for the gear teeth and throw if needed for comparison.

Posted on: 2016/7/25 11:53
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Re: Fuel sender & 12V conversion on a 1953 Clipper.
#14
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Quote:
As you can see the arm has a slight bend and total length is just shy of 8 inches.

Thanks for the measurement! I'll double check the Ford sender prior to installation, just in case of a mismatch.

Quote:
The gauges actually work on 5v so if you keep the existing instrument voltage regulator in the circuit and run that off the power supply it should be adequate.


Quote:
Am more concerned about using a power supply for the horns. A pair of horns can easily pull 25 amps so "small" might not cut it but more importantly is if the power supply is rated for coils, motors or other inductive loads. Some are but most are not and any inductive load or something that has a large instantaneous current draw could make an ordinary power supply that was built for lights, solid state radios and stuff like that self destruct in a matter of seconds.

I've been planning to measure the horns' current needs, but the 6V, 10A power supply I had in mind as a SWAG starter point will clearly be inadequate. 25A horns? No wonder they're so gloriously loud. Need to think about that one further. Good to know the stock voltage regulator will work for the instruments. I suppose the logical follow-up question is; will the horns last on 12V?

Quote:
Also don't forget the heater blower and the stock radio (if you are keeping it). The starter solenoid needs to change and more importantly the starter motor is a concern.


Solenoid will depend on how the starter shakes out, but I don't foresee any trouble with that swap. Plans are in the works for a blower motor. Hunting for a new 12V inline blower or a 12V motor with a similar case and shaft that can accept the original squirrel cage. Long-term plan is to put modern guts in the old radio fascia (several companies do this), so it will eventually be 12V, but it's not a concern for now. Reliable running and driving first.

Quote:
If you are planning on using the stock motor on 12v be advised that several posters over the last year or so have had the nose of the starter crack or break off suddenly for unexplained reasons. The only common denominator was all had been using the stock 6v starter on 12v conversions. It is surmised the reason for the breaking is because the extra voltage is providing so much extra torque and speed that it was slamming the pinion into the stop at the end of case hard enough to break the casting.. Some that went thru the experience had their starters converted to 12v to avoid future problems.


Running through those threads led me a on a goose chase for a modern 12V starter that would drop right into the Packard mount. Several different local shops, including a sizable rebuilder and recycler, had no ideas. Apparently the Packard mount was never used anywhere else. One of them did suggest running the stock starter motor on 12V, and shrugged when I mentioned the nose failure problems. No help there.

Struggling to even find someone in the area who will rewind the starter for 12V. I'd prefer to machine a new nose section for a modern starter, if I can find a suitable option (gear pitch, RPM, tooth count, throw distance, etc.), simply because the old one contains a scary amount of copper dust from the brushes. Feels like a short waiting to happen. Another reason for a modern starter is that I could make my original starter available to restorers. Odds are the Knackered Packard will never be fully original (a reliable driver is goal one), but I do want to keep the sheet metal unmodified and any parts I remove stored and available for the rest of the community.

Posted on: 2016/7/25 9:49
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Re: Fuel sender & 12V conversion on a 1953 Clipper.
#15
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
I'm honestly surprised an all-new tank is just $350. Considering how much labor it will save, that's seriously tempting. Depending on the cost of stripping, welding, and resealing my current tank, don't be shocked if I just pick up a new one.

Still getting used to how analog this car is. An entirely passive fuel level sensing circuit seems like withcraft compared to the 3-wire jobs I'm used to. HH56, do you know if anyone has the correct arm measurement handy?

Posted on: 2016/7/23 0:01
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Fuel sender & 12V conversion on a 1953 Clipper.
#16
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
The fuel tank in my Knackered Packard arrived uninstalled, with extensive internal rust and a 6x8in hole carved into the top with an angle grinder. Sloppy work from a shipper who needed to be sure the tank was drained, apparently. I'm trying to talk a local chemical stripping place into dipping the tank to remove the paint and rust to repair it. Trying to confirm a few details about the Ford sending units specific in the cross-reference.

Has any fitted Ford PN B7A-9275-F to a 1953? The cross-ref specifies it for 1955-1956 vehicles, and Kanter's tempting all-new tank is specified for 1951-1956. So I'm probably good, but confirmation from anyone who's already been through this can save some time. The good news is, the car will have a small 6V power supply for the horns and gauges, so I don't need to futz with finding a 12V sender or adapting the 6V circuitry.

Posted on: 2016/7/22 13:12
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Re: The Knackered Packard (1953 Clipper Touring Sedan)
#17
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
You worked out a very clean, simple installation for the Ghost's belts. Well done, and thanks for saving me the search. Definitely cribbing your ideas. I'm not exactly sure how the seat move will affect the belts yet; focusing on updating the ignition wiring, repairing the fuel tank, and figuring out the 12V starter problem.

On another note, does the Ghost have original upholstery? I believe mine was redone at some point, and I haven't seen a clean reference image for the original fabric before seeing that thread you linked.

Posted on: 2016/7/19 13:30
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Re: The Knackered Packard (1953 Clipper Touring Sedan)
#18
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Thanks, Steve. I'm collecting plenty of photos as I go, and rest assured, I'll be updating that CL post photo with something a little more polished as soon as the old beast's back on the road.

Posted on: 2016/7/19 9:07
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Re: The Knackered Packard (1953 Clipper Touring Sedan)
#19
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
Seat belts are definitely happening. 3-point, if I can figure out a way to attach the shoulder points without modifying the headliner and other interior trim. For the front, there's a trim overlap I can probably exploit to route the attachments. The rear may have to live with lap belts.

Thank you for the tip about the front seats. Haven't gotten started on the interior yet, so I'm not exactly sure how I'll tackle it. The seated height is fine, it's just the fore-aft position that makes it a little tricky to maneuver my feet around the pedals.

The suspension geometry problem is a sticky one. That's part of why it's in the indeterminate future. More pressing concerns for now, but I believe I can either live with the geometry problems or engineer my way around them. If I want to go the whole hog, I have some friends who manufacture excellent fabricated steel kingpins designed for off-road vehicles. Odds are they could set me up. Whatever happens, permanently modifying factory hardware is not in the cards.

Posted on: 2016/7/18 17:35
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The Knackered Packard (1953 Clipper Touring Sedan)
#20
Not too shy to talk
Not too shy to talk

Lex
I just collected a 1953 Clipper Touring Sedan in fairly good condition. Located in Lorain, Ohio, about two and a half hours from my home in Detroit. The previous owner claimed it was originally a Texas car by way of New Jersey. Driver's and front passenger's floor boards are rusted through, and the original fuel tank, while present, has a huge hole cut in the top. Apparently that was the work of a shipper who needed to make sure the tank was dry. Why they didn't use the factory drain is beyond me, but it shouldn't be a terribly difficult fix. The floor boards will be a problem, but not an immediate one. They're still solid enough to drive around in dry conditions.

The good news is that the car is in near-complete running and driving condition. The current tires are massively dry-rotted, holding just enough air to inflate and drive around for a few minutes. So it'll get new Diamond whitewalls once I tackle a few other things. New spark plug wires are already on the way. They're the first step in my scheme to make this thing into a daily. Original parts will be retained where possible, but reliability is job one. Any replacement parts will be selected for easy maintenance and readily-available spares, and everything I remove will be carefully stored or made available to the community. Over the next few months, every wire, line, and hose in the car will be re-plumbed. I'm also planning to move the front seats back about 4 inches; at 6'4", fifties cars don't fit me terribly well.

The rest of the plan is a bumper-to-bumper 12V conversion anchored by a GM CS130 alternator, a rewound or replaced starter motor, an electric fuel pump, diode-based interior lighting, and a 6V DC-DC power supply for the horns and cluster, all connected via a scratch-built, weather-sealed harness. On the several-years scale, a 5-speed manual conversion is likely, along with a subtle drop (2in or so) and new period-look wheels from Detroit Steel Wheel Co. or SoCal Speed Shop.

And yes, Mal, it's already in the registry.

Posted on: 2016/7/18 12:29
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