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Re: Ken's 1937 120 Touring Sedan
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
I'll need to learn how to adjust the valves on mine at some point. Not really looking forward to it.

Tell me about this gano filter. Never heard of it. And it's okay to use Evaporust in the cooling system? Might need to do that on mine too.

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/22 20:45:49
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Don - your situation certainly complicates things. At least I have a short drive into town to grab things if I need to (except for being quarantined at home). The problem I'm finding is that NAPA rarely has what I need when I need it, so I will have to order things in advance.


Took a break from working on the Panama yesterday, back at it today with a few small things.

Cleaned up the front seat mounts in preparation for putting back in the car after insulation arrives. The mounting areas of both were covered in rust. I cleaned everything I could with a wire wheel, scrubbed some Ospho over them to convert any small areas of rust that remained, cleaned them with water, then sprayed with clear lacquer to protect.

Next I test fit the interior windshield trim and rearview mirror to be sure everything lined up. I had to adjust a bit on my welds on the pillars, but everything ended working out fine. I will need to source new screws for most everything because all the originals were rusted. Eventually I'll need to sandblast and repaint these trim pieces.

I then took an old local election sign and made a package tray and the rear seat divider out of it. These signs are strong and can't rot, so it seemed like it would work. Paul Jewett (no idea who he is) will live on this car. I'm going to be doing the trunk in dark gray carpet, so I will need to get some of that on the divider before I attach it. I believe the package tray is supposed to be covered in vinyl (Ivory in my case) so that will have to wait.

Lastly I figured out why my brake lights weren't working. The connections were all corroded. Cleaning both the plugs and the contacts solved the problem. I covered them with heat shrink to protect them. The brake system is all sort of weird in the car because of the change to a dual master cylinder. Eventually I will change it all over, but first I will at least start with replacing all the old lines (all the ones attached to the master cylinder are newer) and redoing everything inside the drums.

-Kevin

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jpg  Rusted seat mounts.jpg (456.74 KB)
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jpg  Seat mounts cleaned.jpg (468.44 KB)
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jpg  Test fitting the windshield trim.jpg (410.27 KB)
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jpg  Packard tray and rear divider.jpg (366.52 KB)
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jpg  Cleaned and protected brake light contacts.jpg (368.77 KB)
1059_5fb9ac30512de.jpg 576X1024 px

Posted on: 11/21 16:09:24
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Don - thanks for the tips. I haven't decided yet if I want to try and tackle the carb rebuild myself or just have someone else do it. I'd like to learn (and save money) but I also don't want to screw it up worse.


Being stuck at home makes it hard to get stuff done on the car because I can't go out and get supplies. Right now I'm trying to plan out next steps and it's a bit overwhelming.

1.) Finish insulation and carpet installation. Need to find some good indoor/outdoor carpet to put on the foot rest.
2.) Headliner installation. This really ought to go in before the windshield, as it is much easier to access the front area without the glass in the way. The headliner has to go in before I can get any trim and/or weather stripping back on over the side windows.
3.) Clean out drip rail down to bare metal, clean up rust, and seam seal the whole thing
4.) Paint the pillars and windshield mounting area. Probably will need to strip the whole roof and redo it
5.) Install windshield and new gasket
6.) At some point during all this redo the entire brake system
7.) Probably will need to pull the whole front clip, clean up the entire front of the car, clean out the entire cooling system, replace or repair the heater core, redo the whole air system (air intakes, heater valve missing, etc), new gaskets on the exhaust, and repaint everything


And that's just the stuff to get the car up and running on the road. Doesn't include redoing the door panels, stripping and repainting the interior trim and dash, weather stripping the entire car, new tires, chrome, etc.

Sounds simple enough, right?

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/21 12:37:56
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Howard - Thanks, that is a helpful chart to have. What is the normal operating temps for these straight 8's? 190 seems a bit high to me, especially if I were to have a 170 degree thermostat in there. Like I said earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if the thermostat is non-functional.

Tobs - There is a really high chance that the accelerator pump is bad. I haven't rebuilt the carb yet. I'll probably have to do that this winter. Ideally I'd like to rebuild and find the original thermostatic choke unit. Some previous owner removed that and installed a manual choke, which I hate. And I will definitely need to look at the heater core...I'm positive it's leaking now.

John - That's what I'm thinking, and that wouldn't surprise me. I really ought to get all new exhaust gaskets anyways. Maybe a good excuse to take off the fenders and clean up/paint the engine and bay??


The real question is why am I seeing so much smoke from the exhaust in the first place? My compression numbers looked good, so it wouldn't be bad rings, would it? I know I'm running too rich still, but would that cause smoking?

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/19 22:17:32
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Ernie - thank you. It was taking quite a bit of cranking. The car hasn't been started in over a month and all the fuel system components were new (and empty) except for the main line from the front to the back.


Success! I unattached the flex line at the hard line connection, then blew compressed air into the fuel tank and confirmed that fuel was making it to the front of the fuel line. Then used a large syringe and injected fuel through the flex line into the inlet side of the fuel pump (about 50ml at least). Refilled the carb float bowl and got it to start. It was very rough at the beginning but got better.

The fuel pump (vacuum section) was super loud for several minutes, but that eventually quieted down as well.

The Good
-Oil pressure on the gauge shows about 25-28 lbs at idle once warmed up. Increased to somewhere above 30 when rev's increased. I'm assuming that's a decent reading.
-Temp gauge works now, so that's a positive. The picture shows the temp after idling for 15 minutes. Not sure what that correlates to in actual degrees Fahrenheit.
-New heat riser spring seems to work as expected.

The Bad
-Car still smokes out the exhaust a lot. I'm not sure what to make of that. I can't tell what it smells like (no sense of smell right now) but I'm assuming it still smells like oil. Fuel coming into the glass bowl is clean and clear.
-Also seeing two spots of smoke/vapor in the engine bay. One is coming from the heater box, which makes me think the heater core is leaking. Correct? The other is coming from somewhere down between the intake and exhaust manifolds. See arrows on picture. No idea what the second one is.
-I'm not seeing any flow through the radiator once operating temp is reached. Upper hose is pretty soft, and I've never felt any coolant run through it. Stuck thermostat maybe?
-Car stumbles and dies on anything but the very lightest acceleration when in gear.

-Kevin

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jpg  Oil pressure at idle.jpg (639.73 KB)
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jpg  Idle operating temperature.jpg (630.02 KB)
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jpg  Vapor and smoke locations.jpg (527.97 KB)
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Posted on: 11/19 10:10:27
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Don - the pump you showed has the "bubble", for lack of a better word, on the outlet side of the pump. From what I've read that was only a thing on the '51-52 pumps. But they should all be interchangeable between years I would think.

I'm heading back into the garage to do some troubleshooting. I'm going to get the car running today. Hopefully.

****EDIT - just checked the vacuum ports while the engine cranks, and there is definitely suction. So the pump seems to be installed on the cam correctly. I'm at a loss here. I think my next step is to disconnect the flex hose and see if I can either suction or pressurize fuel to reach that point. Then maybe inject some fuel into the inlet side of the pump?

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/19 8:20:55
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Howard - Cutting the hole in the trunk is an option, but not one that I'd like to do if I can avoid it. I might drop the tank one more time, but after that I'm throwing in the towel and getting the cutting wheel out.

Don - the pump inlet and outlet are as pictured on other 327 engines I've seen (BigKev and Ross). The outlet should go towards the front of the car, and the inlet points to the rear. Pictures I've seen have a 90 degree fitting on the rear inlet side, pointing out towards the side of the car. I'm assuming this is to aid the flex hose from having too sharp an angle. The old pump I pulled off had the in/out ports backwards by 180 degrees, and therefore the fuel line to the carb was all sorts of weird. I've attached pictures showing the old vs new pump, BigKev's engine, and one that Ross posted earlier.


Still no luck on the fuel. I filled the float bowl on the carb a couple of times and the engine started for maybe a few seconds, but that failed to get the pump to push any fuel. Tried several times with same result. Also pulled the gas cap and gently blew some compressed air into the tank (sealed the rest of the fill tube with a rag) to see if I could push fuel past the pump. Still nothing.

Is it possible that the cam rider isn't seated on the cam? I tried as much as I could to make sure it was on the cam, but there is literally no way to see once the pump is in there.

I should also add that I haven't hooked up any vacuum lines to the pump yet. NAPA doesn't have what I need. So I just blocked them off with tape. The old pump's vacuum ports were wide open, but it still worked....

Frustrating.

-Kevin

Attach file:



jpg  Old meets New.jpg (508.66 KB)
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jpg  BigKev's engine.jpg (291.67 KB)
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jpg  Ross's engine.jpg (234.82 KB)
1059_5fb5f638c7f76.jpg 890X889 px

Posted on: 11/18 20:36:28
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Thanks Howard. I really don't want to drop the tank again, but it looks like I might have to. I should have just attached a ground wire to the sender while I had it off. Oh well.

Good know about the oil passages on the passenger side of the engine as well. I wondered what those plugs were for over there.

I ended up getting a cheap oil pressure gauge from the local parts store. After I cleaned off the layers of caked on grease, I was able to see how the oil pressure sender was currently connected. Looks like someone in the past had already put on a tee fitting, and plugged the bottom. I removed the plug on the bottom and attached the gauge there. Theoretically I should be able to still have the idiot light as well as see an actual reading.

Also figured out that the correct filter for my Fram filter assembly is the Fram C-4. It fits much better than the smaller Napa 1080, which would be correct for the factory oil filter canister.

Fresh oil, filter, ethanol free gas, charged battery, went to start the car and didn't work. Cranks, but obviously no gas is getting pumped. Even after quite a bit of cranking. Float bowl is bone dry and no signs of gas anywhere. So what did I do wrong?


-Kevin

Attach file:



jpg  Oil sender fittings.jpg (684.24 KB)
1059_5fb5c3ed8b370.jpg 1024X702 px

jpg  Double pressure gauge.jpg (546.64 KB)
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jpg  Under dash pressure gauge.jpg (543.12 KB)
1059_5fb5c4183d5d2.jpg 1024X704 px

jpg  Fram C-4 filter.jpg (561.48 KB)
1059_5fb5c439ececa.jpg 1024X692 px

Posted on: 11/18 17:02:55
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Another day of being stuck at home. Got the fuel pump installed as well as a reproduction heat shield from Max Merritt. Also bent up a fuel line to the carb. NAPA only had plastic/rubber coated lines, so it's black. I believe original was silver, but at least this won't corrode. Still need to make vacuum lines.....what diameter are the metal lines and associated rubber? I will need to order them in since I'm stuck at home.

Currently working on a few odds and ends. The fuel and temp gauges have never worked. After all the work I've done today they still do not work. Here's what I've done:

-Checked voltage from instrument voltage regulator....bounces around but is around 5 volts (I believe this is how it works. An average of 5 volts, right?)
-Pulled both the gauges and noted bent indicators. Straightened out
-Cleaned out gauges with compressed air.
-Grounded the wires from the sending units. Indicator did not immediately move. They did eventually, but not smooth at all, and not fast at all.
-Dropped fuel tank (again), pulled new sender and confirmed it works (resistance readings were as expected)
-Cleaned off around sender mount to be sure that it was bare metal. Really hard to tell if it's metal or not because it's the same color as the paint.
-Reinstalled tank and confirmed everything hooked up, including added ground wire from tank flange.

Still no dice. It's getting rather annoying. Should I just get new gauges?

Speaking of gauges, I want to install a mechanical oil pressure gauge under the dash to make sure my oil pressure is good. I don't trust the idiot light. What have you guys used and how did you hook it up? Ideally I'd like to keep both the original idiot light and have an actual gauge.

-Kevin

Attach file:



jpg  Heat shield installed.jpg (587.34 KB)
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jpg  Gauge bent indicator.jpg (352.42 KB)
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jpg  Indicator straightened.jpg (421.46 KB)
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jpg  What's paint and what's metal.jpg (411.55 KB)
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Posted on: 11/18 12:29:39
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 299
Well, it looks like I'll probably be stuck home for two weeks. Exposure to COVID and likely symptoms. So I'll make use of the time and get as much done on the Panama as possible. Thankfully a shipment of parts from Max Merritt came in.

First up is getting the new fuel pump installed. I got the remaining missing pieces (flexible fuel line, new hard line from pump to carb, mounting spacers and washers, gasket) and proceeded to install. The fiber spacers were too long (see pic) so I had to cut them down. I used a very thin layer of gasket sealer for extra leak security on both sides of the gasket.

The flex fuel line is from Dwight Heinmuller, and I know it's not totally correct. I contacted Niagara Packards regarding theirs, but they wanted me to send a check. I was in more of a hurry so opted to grab one from Dwight because I could pay online and have it shipped immediately.

Check the install, and especially the hard fuel line location from the fuel tank. Does this look right to you? Everything was wrong on the fuel pump when I got the car, so I'm wanting to be sure I'm putting it back together right.

Also going to install a new heat riser spring, which looks nothing like the old one.

Lastly, I got a new battery ground strap. The old one was attached to one of the mounting bolts for the oil filter bracket. I haven't seen any pictures to say this is right, and no pictures I've seen show the actual mounting location for the strap. Where am I supposed to attach it?

-Kevin

Attach file:



jpg  Max Merritt shipment.jpg (454.92 KB)
1059_5fb4291ebd71c.jpg 1024X590 px

jpg  Fiber spacers too long.jpg (352.50 KB)
1059_5fb42948e15f5.jpg 576X1024 px

jpg  Oil and gunk cleaned off.jpg (570.11 KB)
1059_5fb4296922d6c.jpg 1024X576 px

jpg  Pump installed with flex line.jpg (799.11 KB)
1059_5fb4298335c50.jpg 1300X731 px

jpg  Heat riser spring differences.jpg (575.02 KB)
1059_5fb429a0776a2.jpg 1024X654 px

Posted on: 11/17 11:50:59
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