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Re: 1934 Packard Twelve at "Disaffected Musings" blog
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Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
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I wrote a longish post on this car a few years ago. I have looked for it in both Packard forums and for some reason I can't find it. I get to write it again.

I retired last year from a long career selling musical merchandise to school programs . The first of these jobs was at the now defunct Merit Music in New Canann, Connecticut. We rented about 600 instruments and there were 500 students taking lessons .

One of the adult students was Earl Thiel. He was an engineer or chemist or something and commuted from Weston , Connecticut to Wayne New Jersey everyday.

Earl was older, (maybe my age today!) and a real scholar and gentleman. He dressed and looked like a farmer and had a slow, shy aw shucks demeanor. He read philosophy and had machine shop skills. He is one of the most intelligent people I have known.

He liked cars. He had a huge garage attached to his house with one small door to take a car out. He never traded in a car when he bought a new one. He had a bathtub Packard, a XK140 Jag coupe with a competition engine, and a 1967 Ford LTD four door with a 427 and a factory 4 speed on the floor.

He bought the Packard in the link above off a used car lot in Norwalk 1956 for $375.00. I don't how much he drove it , but it had been garage bound for a number of years when I knew him. A friend of mine was working on it. The fenders and other parts were on the floor. The color was "Boticelli Blue", a dark blue with maybe a purple tint.

A friend of mine had me offer him a restored Stutz LeBaron SV16 coupe for a trade. Earl pointed out to me that if he did that he wouldn't have the Packard anymore .

My friend and I would go over on a Saturday afternoon. We would hang out , look at the cars and his machine tools. We would sit in his den and talk about cars and have a shot of whiskey.

The phone would ring. We hear\, one end of the conversation.
"Yes,....,
yes,.....
yes, ......

No Thank You."



A few weeks later, during the whiskey time. The door bell rings.

"Mr. Thiel. "

"Yes? "

"I am so and so from the Chandler Collection. Do you still have the Packard? Well, here is my card. Let me write a number down on it. If it is interesting at any time please give me a call."


It was like being married to Marilyn Monroe.

When Earl died , his son found a list with 58 names and phone numbers on it. The son started calling the numbers on the list. the car was sold to the first person who answered the phone.

People cried foul. The car change hands twice in the next 24 hours, the price doubling each time.

It ended up with a well known collector in New Jersey. Before the restoration was finished it was sold to another well known collector in New Jersey.

The last time I saw the car it was in a trailer going to a concourse someplace in its new color scheme. I like light green a lot, but I wish it was still dark blue.

I miss Earl.

Regards


John Harley

Posted on: 2019/11/24 20:01
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Re: 1948 and 1950 custom fastbacks
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2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Steve

I knew that about the 23rd series Custom Eights but forgot to remember. That may explain why I have not seen any.

Best
John Harley

Posted on: 2019/10/24 10:21
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Re: 1948 and 1950 custom fastbacks
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2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Judge

Bathtub Packards models are often confused with one another. If you truly have a Custom Eight Club Sedan, they are extremely rare. The estimate of survivors in the US of 22nd series in the US is less than twenty, perhaps twelve to fourteen . There were over 1100 Packards at the Packard Centennial in 1999, but no Custom Eight Club Sedans.

The production off the 23rd series Custom Eights was much lower: the Custom Eight was a very slow seller as it was more expensive than a Cadillac. By 1950 Cadillac had the OHV V-8 and Packard would not have one for another 5 years. I have never heard of an existing 23rd series Custom Eight Club Sedan .

Parts of the side trim on the Custom Eight Club sedans are different from the junior cars and are unobtainable. I have a friend who was reasonably well connected and he was unable to find a small piece 20 years ago and it was for a 22nd series. I imagine you would have to have parts fabricated for your project.

I am very fond of the Custom Eights. They are magnificent beasts and significant automobiles. I just spent a wad on my 1948 sedan to install a rebuilt engine and rebuild the transmission . Getting it done was somewhat of a challenge but I am lucky to have a number of knowledgeable and well connected friends.

Best of luck with your car

John Harley

Posted on: 2019/10/24 8:10
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Re: 1941 Packard 160 - Hemmings
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Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Gentlemen

I had a 1941 160 for few years and got familiar with how the cars were equipped.

Color code "P" is the the two tone green and the two tone green interior is code 2207. These are listed in the dealer information, introductory information and other material.
The introductory memo for the two tone upholstery option calls it "Riviera" upholstery. It is pictured in the color flyer inviting prospects to see the senior cars.

Hudson was also trying to liven up their interior schemes in 1941. or "harmonize" them. They called it "symphonic".

Packard did not follow this up after the war until the 1953 model year, when Dorothy Draper was hired as a fashion consultant . Having owned 22nd, 23rd and 24th series cars, I some times feel al little sheepish when looking at how some Chrysler and GM cars from the era were trimmed . There is a school of thought that snazzier interiors might have moved more cars out of Packard showrooms.

The Salesman's Data Book from 1941 explains the dash plastic is color coordinated with the Riviera upholstery and that the dash board is painted the color of the lighter shade of upholstery .

Regards

John Harley

Posted on: 2019/7/22 19:49
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Twelve Volt Conversions
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Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Friends

I have been spending some time on other antique car forums recently, and came across this as a link on a Model T site. I have tracked it down and it is from a large Australian website. The content is mostly vintage electronics , but has Model T content on it also.

I have a hard time understanding why a 12 volt conversion is needed, it strikes me as much easier to properly maintain the car. Here is a thorough explanation of all the problems and damage of a voltage conversion.

http://members.iinet.net.au/%7Ecool386/6or12/6or12.html


Best

John Harley

Posted on: 2019/5/30 4:40
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Re: '50 Custom Eight Sedan
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2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Friends

It is a Deluxe Eight, 120" wheelbase and Deluxe Eight interior door panels. There are seat covers on the car ; the material underneath is houndstooth or something similar. The Eights have stripe upholstery and a single bright metal trim strip on the door panel that is the same shape as the 4 patterns on these door panels.

2252 is indeed a Custom Eight, sedan, a Deluxe Eight sedan should be marked 2262.

These cars can be confusing but the differences are easily spotted with a little study.

Best

John Harley

Posted on: 2019/3/9 18:45
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Re: Earliest documented use of designation 'cormorant'???????
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2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Bob

I think this is covered either in the Automobile Quarterly book or in an old issue of The Cormorant. Someone will probably chime in to correct me.

Packard didn't commit themselves for years and both terms were used. "Cormorant" was chosen about 1953 when they had more pressing issues to attend to.

Most human behaviors are predictable !

Happy New Year!

John Harley

Posted on: 2018/12/23 15:30
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Re: Packard pipe organ
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Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Well, it what is known as a harmonium or reed organ. The sound is made by air passing through metal reeds as in an accordian or party favors, not through pipes. The wind is raised by pumping pedals while you play rather than a blower. The are also known as pump organs.

They werre built for household use or small churches that could not afford the considerable expense of an organ installation.


Regards

John Harley

Posted on: 2018/10/23 19:44
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Re: 1947 Super clipper 356 engine rebuilt
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Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
The 356 replaced the engine in your car and the Twelve in 1940. I tried to buy the engine this morning for my 1948 Custom 8 but it has been sold.

Best

John Harley

Posted on: 2018/10/23 19:38
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Re: Identify the engine
Home away from home
Joined:
2008/12/28 14:37
From Dumont, NJ
Posts: 299
Roundsy

I was going to reply to your original post about your car but for some reason I couldn't find it.

Your car has a 356. I was in the Eastern Packard Club and President twice. I knew Dan reasonably well. He was in business with his brother Frank for many, many years, but Frank had passed away quite some time before I met Dan in 1988.

His shop was behind his home in New Milford, Connecticut. It was a one story cinder block building with two or three rooms. I don't remember a lift but he had an old fashioned lubrication pit. There was no pavement going to the building. Whatever car was in the building in November would be there until later in the spring.

i remember your car very well. It turned up in Connecticut one spring at the shows. This would be the late '90's, I think. It attracted a lot of attention from us as we didn't know it and it was flawless. Not only was it in very good shape but everything was absolutely correct. I remember talking with the owner once or twice. There was a story about it I don't remember, I'm not sure he realized what he had.

By the next spring it belonged to Dan. He had slowed down or retired and had sold his Custom Eight, so he needed a Packard. By the the annual EPC picnic in August it had the 356 in it. The hood was open the whole time with a crowd around e car.

I asked him about it.

"Oh , I went out back one morning into the garage and looked the engine in the corner and then the car. i wondered if it would fit"

"How much work was it?"

"A lot more than I though it was going to be".

"Did you change the front springs?"

"No. it's OK"

"How does it drive?"

"Like nothing I've ever driven before !"

I'm glad the car has turned up and is being taken care of. The EPC fell apart after the founding generation all died. Perhaps the best explanation is the club expired of a broken heart. I miss them.

There is an example of Dan's work in Packard, the Pride, by Juile Fenster. The 1937 Super Eight Victoria Coupe belonged to his sister in law Gloria Malumphy. Dan restored it. Gloria did the upohlstery. It was at every Annual Dinner and would some sort of award every year. I wish I had the funds to track it down and purchase it. We all loved that car.

It was originally black. The maroon it is now we called Malumphy Red. Unless a customer of his was strong willed, he would advise painting a car that color when it went through his shop...

Regards


John Harley

Posted on: 2018/10/4 20:47
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