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37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#1
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Larry Reber
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Ok,,, I have started the reassembly on the engine, installed the rear main seal, and dry install the mains and rods to plastic gauge , mains were center of the bands, rods were less than .001 and more than .0005 inches.
So r&r crank,, lube with assy lube, using a breaker bar on the balancer nut to rotate the crank
commenced torquing, l did the mains to 85 lb and could could rotate the Crankshaft fairly easily,
Did the rods next after oiling the pistons and cylinders I installed the pistons and rod bearings.


TROUBLE arose.

I Figured torque was in the 45 lb for this engine.
Ok...
Problem
can only torque rod caps to 15lb and still rotate the Crankshaft,

So. Looking for some insights,

Crank was 10 under ground and I purchased the 10 over bearings.
Rod caps were resized for the late model 10 over bearings



My thoughts are to torque the rods to 15 to 18 pounds and install the cotter pins.
Run the car for about 100 miles and pull the pan and torque to 45 pounds, and check rotation,

I wanted a tight engine and it seams that's what I have.


Thanks in advance for your experience.

Larry

Posted on: 2020/2/14 14:58
Larry Reber
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#2
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Duncan Michael
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If you can rotate the engine at 15# on all rod bolts, tighten one rod to 40# and rotate. If it still rotates easily go to the next. When it becomes hard to rotate, you have found the problem.

I don't use bearing guard. Use the oil that it will be running in service. Also check the caps. Are any swapped or backward?

I would not run the engine without the proper torque applied to the rod nuts. Bolts need to be stretched to provide the proper clamp load.

Posted on: 2020/2/14 18:36
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#3
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John
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I didn't think the 6 had a rear seal? Only a slinger.

Posted on: 2020/2/14 19:05
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#4
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Owen_Dyneto
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Good call, ptv - sounds like another case of a seal installed where none belongs, the 6 and junior 8 used a slinger thru 1947. Seems highly unlikely however that it could add enough friction to contribute to the problem. But it should absolutely be removed.

And I strongly second Duncan's advice, I wouldn't drive the car 20 feet with bearing capscrews so much less than recommended torque.

Posted on: 2020/2/14 19:45
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#5
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Larry Reber
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Thanks for the info.
I am Using a best gasket set that had the graphite rope and install instructions for a Packard.

The oil slinger now makes sense since it dug into the rope.

I'll be getting it removed and retorque the bearings.

Thanks Larry,
Oh.
Engine building experience
High school, rambler 6
1990's did a 49 Buick 8
2000 did a 27 Model t (still have that one)
Now my 37,

Henry Ford said once,
An educated man is not one who knows it all but knows how to find the answer,


Thanks for educating
Larry

Posted on: 2020/2/14 22:17
Larry Reber
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#6
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Larry Reber
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Removed the graphite seal.

Removed all rod caps, wiped all pre-lube bearing surfaces with 30W,
While cleaning I saw that the edges of the bearings were being polished and the centers were not.

Discussed this with the friend who is assisting and he questioned a radius at the edges of the journals.

That brought back the discussion with the crank guy that he was going to do a radius,,,

From what I remember from last summer the crank was square cut on the journal to counter weight and he was going to add what ever radius he could.

So on Thursday we are going to do the adjustment to the edges


More later this week

Posted on: 2020/2/16 18:08
Larry Reber
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#7
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Larry Reber
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SO Here is the latest on the ROD BEARING issue,

The problem revolved around the sizing of the rod journals, the ".010" over bearings a and 2 replacement 39 rods ordered in for pin bushing issues.

1. The crank was turned .010 under and I did not realize 37 .010 bearings are not available. ( MY MISS, not the suppliers) This resulted in purchasing 39 and up .010 over bearings.

2. During reassembly the Mains worked very well, As discussed above there were issues with the rods.
The final answer to this is,,, The .010. bearings were the same size of the journals, actually I believe they were about .001 smaller ID than the OD of the journal.

3. Back to CUSTOM CRANK , Bill did a GREAT job in resizing the journals to fit the replacement rods and bearings to correct fitment,

4. While at CUSTOM CRANK Bill identified the 39 rods were a touch too thick and sized the one he had.

5. 39 rods are heaver than 37 rods,

6. Reassembled all rod caps with bearings, Flat sanded the sides of the rods and matched to the 37's, removed some material from the sides of the 39 rods ( casting excess) until all 6 with pistons matched in weight.


Cost for this repair, 2 hours shop time and materials, about the same to as the crank turned the first time and a new set of rod bearings since the set I was installing got messed up.


LESSON LEARNED,,,,, Verify , ( the info was printed on the .010. I just missed it,,,,,,) Get your rods bearings etc gathered up then have the crankshaft turned to spec.

Posted on: 2020/4/3 23:33
Larry Reber
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#8
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toymanbob
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I had the same issue when assembling my '38 six cylinder. I always tongue the rod caps with the bearings in place prior to installation. This allows a measurement and comparison to the crank size. What a shock I felt when seeing this. First photo in post. Bob

http://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=21878&forum=1

Posted on: 2020/4/6 11:17
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Re: 37 6 cylinder reassemble issues
#9
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John
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Glad it all worked out on your '37. John

Posted on: 2020/4/9 21:22
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