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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#61
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Mahoning63
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What Hudson had to offer was a stamping and body shop. That was worth $7-12 million to Packard if it could have figured out how to use it. And Hudson had the engineering and plant experience to support it. What did Packard know about stamping and welding up bodies after having been out of the business for a dozen years? No wonder they blanked up royally with the '55's. Stuck doors, misalignment, poor fit. "Gap and flush."

Nash also had this capability and the Pininfarina concept shows what was possible. I didn't show it in the collage because it was completed in 1955, well after the key decisions were made. As leverage Nance could have insisted on a new top hat for Packard to agree to merge and close down EGB and vacate Conner. Don't see any benefit to Packard had it merged with Nash and used Nash's boring body for '55, sales would have suffered. Packard outsold the combined sales of Nash and Hudson large cars that year. If they merged but didn't share bodies asap then the initial savings would have been superficial and losses high. It's a sad reality but when a company's sales and profits are shrinking they need to get people off the payroll and close plants.

Monobilt was tough to modify except for outer skin. On the other hand had they got the basics right they wouldn't have needed to touch any more than the skin for a half dozen years or more. Cadillac sold basically the same car from 1950-53 and again from 1954-56, with only superficial appearance changes. So did Lincoln from 1952-55. The annual model change didn't get going until late in the decade and it eventually petered out. The '65 Cadillac platform lasted through '76 and the one that followed lasted into the early 90s before it even saw a new top hat.

Re: Clipper greenhouse drop, there is a 1 to 1.5 inch high beltline below the windshield, side glass and backlight that would be removed. Mods to cowl and end panel at base of backlight would be needed to accept glass touchdown. Not saying it would have been easy but it is where the industry was headed. These types of things need to start with a "hey, what if" from someone overturning stones, followed by an appearance study, followed by a design and manufacturing feasibility study, then a cost and affordability study, marketing assessment, timing, return on investment and finally, a decision. Torsion-Level was going to sell these Hudsons but they needed to present a reasonably low car to be seen as a credible replacement.

The Jet also needed its greenhouse dropped, this time by 4 inches! That's what the car originally called for before Barit intervened. Make that change and I think the Jet would have taken off. Not sure the 308 would have been a good engine to offer but certainly the 232 and 262 Sixes would have made the car quick, if heavier up front.

Was the Nash-Healey gone by '55? Interesting idea. What about taping Darrin to sell his Henry J-based sports car as a Packard Darrin? With Packard grill and 352 V8.

Posted on: 2020/4/23 14:48
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#62
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Mahoning63
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Let's take a look at another opportunity, a 149 wheelbase Limousine. The frame was there for the using and now that Packard owned Conner there was no reason why they couldn't have set up an off-line station to build up the body. Another off-line station later along the assembly line could have assembled the division window and other interior elements. Because the car could have run down the main line for most of its assembly the price could have been brought down to match Cadillac Series 75 and still delivered profit. Ultramatic, A/C, Torsion-Level and heated rear seats standard!

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Posted on: 2020/4/23 19:17
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#63
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Mahoning63
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And a confident Packard would have built two or three convertible sedans and got them out on the parade circuit, giving away nothing to Cadillac. Nothing!!

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Posted on: 2020/4/23 19:35
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#64
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Mahoning63
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And let's add a 127 wheelbase Executive Sedan to take Nance and other big wheels to the office and Wall Street. Division window optional. No need for Derham were Conner to have found its mojo.

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Posted on: 2020/4/23 19:48
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#65
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bkazmer
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any issues with the torsion bars lengthened to this extent?
Padded roof standard - hides the roof surgery.

Posted on: 2020/4/23 19:50
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#66
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Mahoning63
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Easy task to do a Club Brougham too, very personal and exclusive.

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Posted on: 2020/4/23 19:56
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#67
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Mahoning63
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There is a brief discussion of Torsion-Level on would-be '55 LWB cars on pg 710 of Kimes' book that suggests there would not have been an issue.

Yes, padded roof for sure unless someone ordered a car without one.

Count a total of 8 wonderful Packards on three chassis with minimal extra tooling over what they spent.

Posted on: 2020/4/23 20:30
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#68
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Mahoning63
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Realized I forgot about occupant packaging in the earlier Clipper-based '55 Hudsons of a few comments ago so updated the images with many changes. Check them out if interested.

One of the changes was to raise the seats and steering wheel back to standard height, which raised something else... a question. What happens to headroom front and rear and visibility out the windshield, specifically the up-angle, if roof and windshield header are lowered 1.5 inch inches? If you are curious, have a '53-54 sedan and a 1.5 inch thick book, would appreciate what you discover if you sit on the book in the front and rear seat. If you are 6' or taller I'd be extra specially double secret curious.

Also, after going round and round and back and forth on a solution, moved the windshield wiper assembly rearward a bit. Of course, what's up top is only the tip of the iceberg so the motor below might have also needed to move, were space available. And the wipers would have needed shortened a bit since windshield header was lower. Thought about sinking the assembly below the cowl to keep the wipers low on the windshield when in resting position but that might have opened up an very slimy can of worms.

Posted on: 2020/4/24 15:23
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
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John
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To bad we can't pick and chose what to combined. But I think the Willys Aero was a better car than the Hudson Jet.

Posted on: 2020/4/24 18:24
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#70
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Mahoning63
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The nice thing about this exercise is that we all get to pick whatever we like!

First image is 105 wb Jet with 60.9 inch height. Next to it is a version with greenhouse lowered 3 inches for a new height of 57.9 inches.

Second image pits the Willys Aero with its 108 wb and 60 inch height next to the lowered Jet.

The Jet was functional and roomy inside but at expense of styling. Lowered 3 inches as Spring had wanted it matches fairly well with Aero though the latter is several inches wider. I think the lowered Jet and Aero are equally compelling.

If Packard had bought Hudson in 1954, dropped the big Step-Down and re-purposed Clipper - perhaps as suggested, kept Jet and spent a million dollars lowering its greenhouse for '55 and adapting Torsion-Level, and made a big push to export it and the rejuvenated Packards to Europe and elsewhere, I think Packard-Hudson might have had a really good year and a bright future.

Hudson lost a ton of money in 1954 and Nance probably would have been able to determine early in the year a rough ballpark of how bad it would be. Maybe he could have given Barit an ultimatum of sorts: rework the Jet for '55 as suggested using the last of Hudson's capital, plan for a Clipper-based big Hudson for '55 and prepare for the official merger after Hudson closes the fiscal year and booked its losses. This would have made Hudson as cheap as possible for Packard. Barit would have had no other option except to sell to Nash and see Jet liquidated.

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Posted on: 2020/4/24 21:50
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