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Board index » All Posts (Troy8466)




Re: 1956 Packard Patrician Rebuild Project
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Troy Taylor
I will do so this evening when I get home. I was doing a little work here in the office when I cam across this revelation lining up some engine paint. I will verify the numbers against the door this evening.
This is disturbing as the story is this is a one owner car that drove from 56-69 and then warehoused it in a heated facility for 45 years. I'm thinking it had more road time that at this point.

Posted on: 2013/10/23 9:01
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Re: 1956 Packard Patrician Rebuild Project
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Troy Taylor
Ok, Interesting question. As I have gotten into this car, I have noticed that it appears the car has been at least partially taken down prior. Missing or loose hardware etc. One of the troubling things I noticed is that the Air Conditioner and assorted hardware was missing from the engine. Of course because I want to do an Original restore, I would have been added it back on. However, no mounting brackets, no pulleys etc are left on the engine. I will be pulling the engine this week end and obviously I wanted to make sure the engine was painted back to original. In doing so, I am now even more miffed and questioning if I even have the original Patrician Engine in the car. Why do I wonder this?

My Engine block and heads are Metallic Green. Metallic Green was the color of the 56 Executive 352. I also have a Bronze intake manifold which again was green on the Executive 352 and Bronze on the 374 Patrician.

The 56 Patrician 374 should be a Bronze block and heads with Bronze Intake. Valve covers should be Silver with Red letters however, I have the optional Chrome.

What's the consensus out there, Do I have a mismatched Engine? i.e. 352 block with pat intake?

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Posted on: 2013/10/23 8:46
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Studebaker / Packard Stock
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Troy Taylor
I just invested in 100 common shares whoo hoo, I'm rich.

Nice collector's item.

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Posted on: 2013/10/22 7:47
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Re: 1956 Packard Patrician Rebuild Project
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Troy Taylor
Front end gone

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Posted on: 2013/10/13 14:42
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1953 Clipper For Sale
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Troy Taylor
Posting for a friend. car has little rust just wear of the paint and rust repair on rear fender drivers side some small rust spots elsewhere. rewired to 12v.

Car located in North East Indiana $3700 Firm.

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Posted on: 2013/10/10 20:14
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Re: Treadle Lightly
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Troy Taylor
Ross- Great addition. That was the point I was trying to make. I think we all want to get our 50+ year old treasures out on the road however, they need a little TLC to restore them to spec and proper operation. My find for example drove from 56-69 and then was parked in a heated factory for 45 years having only mothballs put inside to protect the interior. yes, I was able to stick the fuel line in a fresh gas can, install a new battery and she fired right up. however decay on service parts takes place over the decades and she needs a little TLC to find her way back to glory. I am enjoying this project very much. the only other restore that was this enjoyable was when I restored a WWI Eindecker EIII airplane. Now you want to talk about finding parts......... The patrician is a piece of cake but just as excited to see new life.

Posted on: 2013/9/24 8:09
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Re: German magazine visits Packard Proving Grounds
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Troy Taylor
Nice Article thanx for sharing

Posted on: 2013/9/23 19:40
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Re: Treadle Lightly
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Troy Taylor
In response to where I found the Treadle Vac Parts, here are two sources.

Max Merit

all parts in stock immediate shipment

1.326 part number 474034 $95
1.358 part number 6484066 $95
1.3541 Atmospheric Poppet $15
1.3542 Vacuum Poppet $15

You can also talk to Charod at Kanter Packard Parts Department.

They have the following Kit available

Kit price is $95, Kit consists of the following:

1.3541 Atmospheric Poppet
1.3542 Vacuum Poppet
1.3548 Vacuum Poppet Spring
1.359-Vacuum Diaphragm Gasket

Lead time is about 1-2 wks delivery.

Happy Restoring

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Posted on: 2013/9/23 19:33
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Treadle Lightly
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Troy Taylor
Being a new Packard owner and hobbyist, and new to this sight, I thought I would document my body off restore of my 1956 Patrician. As posted on my restore blog, this is my first classic car rebuild. With that said, I am no stranger to mechanics or restores having restored and new built aircraft coming from the Aerospace background. With that said, I have no intentions on presuming to be an expert on Packard restoration; I simply wish to share my experiences and perspectives.

When I took possession of my Patrician, I was told that the brakes were down. Down they were, in fact the brake pedal was stuck hard to the floorboard. With a little friendly persuasion I was able to free up the peddle. The peddle seamed to operate smoothly after that with no sticking. My first thought was to fill the reservoir and see what I had to work with. When I opened the fill cap and got an eye full of hard crystalized brake fluid, I knew in an instant that the master cylinder had to be pulled.

I did a lot of on line research and read many blogs on this site and other classic car sites on the Bendix Treadle-Vac system. The blogs and articles I read were all over the board in terms of people's opinion on them. Good, Bad, Reliable, Non-Reliable, Safe, Not Safe etc. I read many step by step rebuild papers written by various owners as well as was given some suggestion on my blog on a few people who rebuild them. I see a lot of recommendations to have the Treadle rebuilt by a "professional" yet continued to read blogs on how failures continue to occur with "professional" rebuilds.

I contacted a few of these rebuilders and was quoted prices of @ $200-$400 to rebuild. Having looked at the prices of rebuild kits and various components, I thought to myself, there is no way that you would be getting a complete rebuild of all soft and necessary hard parts at these prices. When I ask, in detail, I am told that the pistons are not disassembled and gone through. To me, that raised some concerns, especially with the high failure rates that were being reported in the blogs. One thing I noticed in all the blogs, at no time did any of them give the condition of the mechanical parts of the Treadle when the failures occurred. In not knowing this, how can anyone truly make a sound judgment on if they are an acceptable master cylinder or "Junk". Common sense tells me cars drove all throughout the 50's and there is no data that I could find anyway on massive Treadle failures. So, wrenches in hand, my rebuild of the Treadle began.
Upon basic disassemble into the three major subgroups, piston, vacuum canister, and the hydraulic assembly. The very first thing I noticed was that the vacuum canister was heavily pitted on one side of the can from top to bottom. Both the Packard Service Manual and the independent rebuild instructions suggest honing the can if needed. After honing, the pitting still remained. The independent instructions stated that pitting would not be a problem. Again, applying common since of piston actuated cylinder, I reasoned with myself how this can possibly be acceptable. My past experience in hydraulic cylinder rebuilds tells me otherwise. The Packard Manual also to me was clear on the allowable conditions of acceptable wear of parts and the can just did not pass that test. I was able to locate a good can from a person on this site and purchased the replacement for $45.

I purchased a rebuild kit from one of the two big names in Packard parts for $95 and the kit is sold as rebuild kit for both Hydraulic and Vacuum sides of the Treadle. I received all seals, O-rings, gaskets for the hydraulic side. This was a very simple and straight forward rebuild. One thing I learned upon further investigation is that Bendix actually made three variations of the check valves. Most that I see sold and the one that came in my kit has the small wafer disc with four holes and the rubber piece. Mine however, is the thimble or hat type. The rubber piece is not an exact fit for this style valve. Question: Have people been using the rubber piece anyway with the thimble or have they replaced the thimble with the wafer? If so, does this change the function of the Treadle and could this be a possible cause of some of these failures? Don't know, but I did some digging and ordered the right rubber for my thimble style valve. In the rebuild kit, I also received a new vacuum hose, piston wick rope, and modern foam to replace the horse hair in the vents. At this point, I could have replace the leather piston cup and just put the Treadle back together. But again, common sense said wait, what does the piston do? You have pressure differential dynamics going in inside the piston compensating for vacuum and atmospheric pressure. If hard brake fluid craped up the hydraulic side, surly there has to be crud in the piston no to mention three very important parts that from my understanding do not normally get looked at in rebuilds.

Upon the disassemble of the piston, yep, there was some hardened contaminants that I am sure if left untouched would have caused a future failure but this was not my main concern. I found three things inside the piston that I am one thousand percent convinced would have caused a very quick if not immediate failure of the Treadle if installed as is. First find was the vacuum poppet compensation stem and journal has enough corrosion on them to not freely operate correctly. 2nd, the rubber on the vacuum and atmospheric poppets were extremely deteriorated and deformed. The rubber was a soft mush that would not have sealed the slightest pressure. The poppets were not a part of the rebuild kit which I found odd, I mean if you are going to rebuild something, rebuild it not just what is easily or convenient. The kit comes with the internal piston gaskets so why not the rest of the components? The poppets are readily available and I purchased the set for $30. In addition, the piston diaphragm was in the same decay as the poppets. There were no tears or holes but the rubber was extremely soft and spongy. Again, no something I would want to reuse. Diaphragms are also readily available for $95.

So, by being a little anal, I did a 100% teardown and inspection of every part and component, I replaced anything that was questionable (coincidently that is exactly what the Packard Repair Manual says to do too) So for approx. $250 and few hours of time well spent, I now have an fully functioning Bendix Treadle-Vac that I am confident will operate reliably as designed. I am lucky enough to live 10 miles from the Bendix (now Honeywell) plant in South Bend. A good friend of mine's father worked 40 years at Bendix as an engineer and still has some old tools around the house. One being a master cylinder tester, the test says we are a go after the rebuild so I will let ya know how I made out. He is confident in his old products. I do feel properly repaired and maintained it should operate safely as intended.

Again, this is my experience and perspectives; I am in no way saying I am right or that anyone I have talked to or dealt with is incorrect.

Happy Restoring.

Posted on: 2013/9/22 22:03
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Re: 1956 Packard Patrician Rebuild Project
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Troy Taylor
must been cause I use my iphone to take the pics. they were all correct on the computer but posted weird. I even rotated a few and tried and got the same results. I will stick to a camera from now on.

Posted on: 2013/9/22 22:01
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