Packard Forum Index » Post-War (1946-54)

Hello all.

I know conventional wisdom says buy the best condition car you can afford, so you don't incur unreasonable restoration costs that may never be recouped.

So, maybe I'm just glutton for punishment, asking the rather dumb question: is this always totally true, or is it sometimes worth it to buy a car in less than great shape, just because it happens to be the right combination of what you want?

I plan on owning a 48 or 49 custom 8 22nd series, and I'm just biding my time, looking around, and deciding whether I could/would spring for the custom convertible, or the custom coupe which I also think is beautiful. There happens to be two C8 convertibles for sale on eBay right now. I'll reference this auction since these are the colors I would like:cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/most-desirable-p ... =US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item1e63b82cfd

In addition to my question above, what $ amount do people think it would take to get this car to a very presentable driver? I don't know exactly what # condition that might be...I'm thinking #3?

Thank you, in advance!

Evan

The car you gave as an example represents some very hefty expenses and time to get it looking good again. The electro-hydraulic window/seat/top system is problematic in many ways. On the other hand, it comes with some very desirable parts and if restored, would be spectacular.

How much of the work are you able/willing to do yourself? If you are considering having all the work done for you to get it up to #3 condition, then I'd guess that you'd spend more than the cost of the car and would end up with a car worth less than you spent. If you had it brought up to #1 condition you would spend way more than the purchase price but the car might (I repeat might) be worth more than you put into it (if you could find a buyer at those stratospheric prices).

I have a 22nd series Custom sedan (condition fair) and a 23rd series Custom sedan (condition good). I bought them knowing with an absolute certainty that I was going to spend more on them than they are worth (monetarily). I bought them because I enjoy having, showing and driving them. I enjoy the look on the face of a 20 something when he looks under the hood and sees the enormous straight eight. I enjoy all the 'thumbs-up' I get just driving around town. I like listening to all the stories from the 50-60 year olds about their father, uncle, or neighbor that 'had one just like it' (even though the car in their memory may have really been a Hudson). That's what makes it 'worth' it to me.

Ultimately it's up to you as to what you want and how much you are willing/able to spend to get it. I personally believe that 'buy the best condition car you can afford' is probably very good advice, I just never followed it.

I saw that car on e-Bay a few days ago. That's a beautiful car! It would be a great choice for a restoration......if you're willing to spend 50K. And then besides finances, the time you put into working on it. You could buy all of your parts immediately and have it painted and say you'll assemble it later. Then something keeps coming up the same day that you want to do something with the car. Overall, that convertible is a very pretty car, but it would take some time and money to get it where you want it. I don't even know that I'd spend more than $15,000 on that car. Good luck!

There is another part to the equation. When you fix up a car that is too far gone you end up with a beat up car, fixed up. The end result is much better if you start with a car that was in decent condition. In other words you can't polish a turd.

It does make sense sometimes to buy a car in less than perfect condition provided it is not too far gone. One reason, you may be able to afford a #3 or 4 car where you could never afford a #1 or 2. Or you may get a lucky deal on a car that is in less than perfect shape.

The upside to a fixer is, if you have a paint job done, for example, you now have a car with new paint and if you take care of it, will look good forever. Likewise upholstery, motor job etc. Sometimes you pay top dollar for a good car and end up doing the work down the road anyway.

If you are keeping the car forever it is academic anyway. Who cares what it might sell for if you are never going to sell it? And time has a way of bailing out extravagant restorations.

If I may offer my two cents.... In 2004 I paid $4,500 for my Standard Eight, which I bought sight unseen on eBay. At the time I was in Alaska and the car was in rural California, so rather than fly there to check the car out (a $1,500, 3-day proposition, at minimum) I decided to take the seller at his word that it was in "excellent condition." The purchase price was well within my means and I figured that if the car was not as advertised I'd just sell it.

I'm a lousy mechanic and had neither the time nor the patience to fix up the car. I flew to California, collected the car and drove it to Seattle, where I'd located a mechanic who was familiar with Packards. My idea was that he would do the few minor repairs expected the car would need. But the trip north was harrowing for many reasons, not the least of which was that only one brake actually worked. There were so many minor emergencies and unexpected complications en route that by the time I reached Seattle I was a jumpy wreck. "Excellent condition," indeed! If I had not already arranged for the mechanic to take in the car, I probably would have sold it on the spot.

It is now seven years later and I have spent more than $40,000 to restore the Packard to a reasonably good, daily driver condition. If I were to try to sell it now, I figure the best I could expect would be about $15,000.

When I bought the Packard I'd never owned an antique car before, so I assumed I'd experience a steep--and expensive--learning curve. The curve was steeper and longer than I expected, but I like to think I've learned a thing or two along the way.

If I had it to do again, I would wait for a car like the one I now own to come on the market. I've seen several cars like it on eBay with asking prices in the $15-20,000 range. If the seller is able to document the restoration work, and if I could personally inspect the car and verify its condition, then I know from personal experience that a $15-20,000 price tag would be a bargain.

Bottom line: unless you like fixing up cars (like Big Kev does), buy a car that has recently been given much love and attention by the seller!

All the best,

Mark

I own and operate a restoration shop in addition to my parts business, we charge $85/hr as we are in a high cost area of the country. Recently we got in a 35 Buick coupe completely disassembled. A year later it was restored to #1- conditiohn as the owner did not want wool upholstery, but modern synthtetic as he is going to drive it with his kids in it. The bill was just over $100,000. The Packard would probably be more as the body is larger and the upholstery more extensive. If the motor is not worked on , just made cosmetically acceptable, deduct $8,000.

If you just want a #3, then the body surfacing would be less, deduct $7000.

There have been some very nice cars in the #2-3 condition in the $50-$60 range, a better buy. But you have to see, oinspect, drive and have a mechanic dn body man go over the car or you could be in for a $5-$20 surprise.

YOu're starting with a Packard, you can;t go wrong if your mind rules your emotions.

Thanks everyone.

While not trying to take the fun and magic out of the experience, I am trying to get an idea of what kind of expense owning a Packard would be like.

I do own (and have owned) antique/vintage MoPars, considerably less expensive cars than Packards. But even on my Dodge and Plymouth, having everyone else do the work became a huge $ drain and took a lot of the fun away. I realized that since this is supposed to be a hobby, 1/2 the enjoyment would be working on the car yourself, so that's what I'm learning to do now, on my much less expensive cars.

When I own a Packard, I plan on doing as much of the mechanical work myself as I can, because by that time, I will know the basics of working on cars, and I'm hoping Packards won't be terribly different. But, I'm also going into the experience without any illusions about what it will cost me.

Check this one out. Yeah, it's not a 'vert or even a 49 at that. The object is to look around, be patient, and most of all, don't ever let emotions get in the way of making a sound BUSINESS decision.

hemmings.com/classifieds/carsforsale/packard/120/1221970.html

If you have the $30K to re-do the 49, (purchase price and the rest) then I suggest looking into one that is ready to drive, such as this 36 that I personally know.

hemmings.com/classifieds/carsforsale/packard/1403/1223037.html

This is just from someone who has been there and done that... and more then once.

A brilliant light just dawned on my marble head.

I've asked many questions about the 48-50 Packards, but I should really take a good test drive, seeing as how driving it should be just as enjoyable as looking at one.

What's the best way to do that? I've felt reluctant to ask that question at the two Packard meets I've gone to. It's just a feeling I get...almost like a breach of some unspoken etiquette. It's as if folks want your admiration of their car, but wouldn't hesitate to tell you 'no' if you asked for a test drive. And I don't want to go find someone with one for sale and request a "test drive" with no intention of purchasing it now.

In the past, I considered a Nash Airflyte of 49-50 (yeah, I like the look). Even though I wasn't ready to buy, I actually got a seller to bring his Airflyte to me and we took a test drive. After I was done, I was surprised to realize my desire for one was gone. I liked (and still like) how they look, but the drive was definitely not what I expected. The car was hard to see out of, the engine felt greatly underpowered, and the inside of the car had zero razzle dazzle to keep an aesthete happy. Plus I felt a bit bad the guy had driven his car to me, and I was not ready to buy. I would prefer to be more upfront about my intentions now.

Is there anyone with a 48-50 Packard in the greater Los Angeles area that would be willing to let a future owner drive and inspect their car, under their supervision? I'm in the San Fernando Valley.

Thanks, in advance!

I'm sure if you attended a few events of either or both of the national Packard clubs and/or their regions (I assume you're a member of one or the other), you'd find someone willing to do that. And if you can, drive both a Custom 8 and a Super or an Eight, the differences between the series, especially the Custom 8, are significant.