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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#71
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bkazmer
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The new Jets can be shipped to Europe with the front clips uninstalled, and have lower duties as 'knock-downs." The right-hand drive units for the UK will receive a different grille and be badged as Railtons.

Posted on: 2020/4/25 8:14
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
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Mahoning63
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The assembly method makes sense and Railton was an education for me, had heard the name but didn't know about the Hudson connection. Wonder if Italia coupe might have also made a good Railton, powered by 308 Six.

Came across this ad for Irish-built Jet. Have lowered the car 3 inches to show suggested change.

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Posted on: 2020/4/25 9:06
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
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Mahoning63
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"How much heavier would the 308 engine been than the 202 engine used in the Italia?"

Was trying to figure that out looking at '55-57 vehicle weights for Wasp 202 Six and Hornet 308 Six. Hard to say but appears to be significant. Another tidbit I came across was that the 308 would have crashed into the firewall. See discussion about 308 in Jet at this link in the Motorsports section:

https://wikivisually.com/wiki/Hudson_Jet

It may well have been the case that the 202 was the only engine that would have packaged. Horsepower eventually rose to 130 so it had potential, and Hudson engineers were pretty resourceful so probably could have wrung out 5-10 more by developing "severe usage" components.

Another approach to the Jet would have been to focus on the 2-door model, turning it into a very sporty hardtop. I initially lowered the greenhouse 3 inches like the sedan but the result didn't seem compelling as a 2-door, demanded more in terms of style. So a hardtop roof was fashioned together with wrapped windshield moved back a few inches. This car would have probably cost an additional $1-2M to tool but in the end I think it would have been the only Jet capable of driving sales of 50K or more. Most Americans didn't want an undersized sedan but many would have felt the allure of a sporty coupe. Overall height would have dropped to 56.5 inches, on par with Studebaker hardtop. With a firm suspension the handling of this spunky Hudson would have been phenomenal and the price reachable by many. Optional trim like Frank Spring's contoured Italia bucket seats and a four-on-the-floor could have expanded its price range. The American Alfa.

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Posted on: 2020/4/25 16:43
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#74
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Mahoning63
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Even as they were expanding Jet's pricing upward they could have lowered the entry model by offering a pillared coupe version. With this car there would have been no reason why it couldn't have stickered same as original Jet. Now the youth market would've had a better chance of obtaining one, and once they got hooked Hudson would have secured its future.

The point of all these Hudson and Packard models is to show not another big Detroit company but instead something special and lasting, founded on content and competence rather than chrome and cush.

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Posted on: 2020/4/25 18:04
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#75
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Mahoning63
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Don't mind me guys, just exploring '55 themes based on Dick Teague and Fred Hudson renderings. The back half of the stock hood is perfectly shaped for this grill.

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Posted on: 2020/4/26 20:15
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#76
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bkazmer
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I think the Request type front is a good fusion of the old upright grille and the 55 era body shape. The hood lines flow nicely. May I suggest putting the round secondary lights out a bit to fall on a diagonal line with the headlights and dagmars? Easy design to facelift by changing grille texture for subsequent model year.

While an upright grille was not typical design language of the time, a flashy front was. I think this gives Packard an immediately identifiable look.

This design would then evolve into something like the Predictor as the overall shape went to the wider/flatter style of the 59-60 cars. The 60 Edsel is more this flavor.

Posted on: 2020/4/27 5:50
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#77
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Mahoning63
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Great suggestion! Here are two versions - with and without turn signal lights. Also the rendering that inspired it. I tried the grill extending all the way down, felt that with a car as tall as Contour the grill ends up too tall. Feel same about the Request. The idea seems to work better in the rendering because it is depicting the low Panther show car in modified form, so the grill ends up not too tall.

I am probably in a small minority that believes that the investors rejected the '57 proposal in part because of the Predictor grill. I just don't think it works on that wide low theme, is too odd and at odds with the rest of the car. Maybe on a narrow car like a '56 Rambler-based Clipper and coupled with Predictor's hidden headlights. I think the '57 Packard needed the Request style grill. With the car's wide and low proportions it would have looked spectacular if done right (i.e., better than my attempt).

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Posted on: 2020/4/27 7:49
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#78
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bkazmer
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I think that a big reason your renderings capture the center grille better is the two half bumpers ended in the dagmars. It looks like the bumpers were not intended to go any further. The Black Bess 57 looks too much like there was a full width grille and bumper, then a gap was sawed in it for the vertical grille.

There is a Facel Vega resemblance.

Posted on: 2020/4/27 8:47
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Re: 1953/4 Caribbean 4-door hardtop sedan exploration
#79
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Mahoning63
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Hmm, see what you mean.

Can also see it working in a sleek sort of way without the dagmars. A Request grill would sit way back rather than protrude forward like Predictor's grill, which was actually a bumper. The horizontal bumpers project forward quite a bit so should have been able to protect the grill.

What I don't like about the last proposal is the painted wasteland left when the horizontal trim that wraps from side to front is removed. Felt I had to get rid of it because it is way over-the-top and crowding the front.

Here's a version that deletes the dagmars and keeps a reined in version of the horizontal trim, now thinner like Predictor show car. Have also added a headlight bezel to driver's side lights; the mock-up doesn't have it.

This is a theme I can honestly support, at least up front. The fins in back need to go as does the rear-axle kick-out, a bad habit borrowed from 60 Special. I know why they all did it - to reuse doors from shorter wheelbase cars - but Cadillac dropped that cost-saving practice for '59 never to use it again.


EDIT: updated grill.

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Posted on: 2020/4/27 10:16
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