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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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JeromeSolberg
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I wonder if it's still wheel bearings, sometimes thing can create a lot of noise but not a lot of heat, think of a whistle.

Like here:

Squeaking wheel bearings.

Posted on: 5/28 2:40
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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Ken_P
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I know you don’t want to do it , but I would pull the drivers side down and replace the wheel bearings. Keep the old ones in case the problem resumes.

I’m guessing you either have an unusual failure mode, or something is out of tolerance because of how you had to fix the warped drum. Good luck!

Posted on: 5/28 8:14
1937 120 1092 - Original survivor for driving and continued preservation.
http://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/mod ... p?topic_id=16514&forum=10

1937 115 1082 - Total basket case, partial restoration, sold Hershey 2015
https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/mod ... &order=ASC&status=&mode=0
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Re: KPack
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r1lark
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Quote:

Ken_P wrote:
I know you don’t want to do it , but I would pull the drivers side down and replace the wheel bearings. Keep the old ones in case the problem resumes.

I’m guessing you either have an unusual failure mode, or something is out of tolerance because of how you had to fix the warped drum. Good luck!


Kevin, if you follow Ken_P's advice, I would also suggest that while that axle is out and the bearing off, you check it for straightness. You may not have the correct tools to do this (a set of shaft rollers to support and roll the axle, and a dial indicator to make the measurements) but a general machine shop should be able to do this quickly. The outer end at the taper would be the most suspect. A alternate method would be to mount the axle in a lathe between two live centers; the machine shop might prefer this method.

I suggest this due to the damage/warping of the brake drum - something significant happened to cause that, and to me at least it makes the axle suspect -- at least enough suspect to check it for straightness while it is out and the axle bearing removed.

Posted on: 5/28 8:54
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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kevinpackard
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I know you guys are right....I've just been trying to convince myself otherwise. Ugh....taking everything back apart again and redoing the whole axle shim thing is such a pain.

I'm going to check with NAPA and see if they can get me the correct bearing and race. Then call around to a couple places and see if they can press the new bearing on the axle and check for axle trueness. Part of me just wants to drop the car off and have someone else do all the work, but I don't think they'll be very familiar with how to work on something like this. I'll probably just pull the axle and take it in.

-Kevin

Posted on: 5/28 9:55
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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Ken_P
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I know you probably don't want to hear this, but it might be a good idea to start looking for a spare axle assembly.

I agree, whatever caused the damage to your rear end seemed significant. It might be worth finding some spare parts in case your axleshaft or housing is bent.

Posted on: 5/28 10:14
1937 120 1092 - Original survivor for driving and continued preservation.
http://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/mod ... p?topic_id=16514&forum=10

1937 115 1082 - Total basket case, partial restoration, sold Hershey 2015
https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/mod ... &order=ASC&status=&mode=0
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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BigKev
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I would at least pull that side apart and check the axle and bearing. Check for any fresh witness marks where something could be rubbing/contacting.

Make sure the edge of the brake shoe metal isn't contacting the drum on the side. Also, make sure the drum isn't contacting any of the hardware or backing plate in any way.

Did you inspect the rear bearing before repacking it? Worn or stuck roller(s)? Scored race? Abnormally loose rollers, or ones with side to side play?

Last thing I could think of is incorrect axle play. Shim stack incorrect.

I'd pull it apart and at least inspect everything before ordering parts. It could be something that just needs adjustment.

Posted on: 5/28 10:35
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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JeromeSolberg
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I don't know if there's a reputable one in your area, but a "rear end shop" should probably be able to deal with your axle and wheel bearing issues, it's not that much different from standard practice in light trucks even today, excepting maybe the differential pinion adjustment.

Posted on: 5/28 10:41
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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kevinpackard
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Quote:
Last thing I could think of is incorrect axle play. Shim stack incorrect.


That's my concern. I thought I did everything right, but I very well could have screwed it up. The bearing was quiet for a the first little while of test drives....maybe 15 miles or so. I'm wondering if my axle shim adjustment wasn't right. I probably should have just left all the shims the way they were when I took everything apart.

The bearing visually looked okay (I'm a novice), the race looked maybe a bit scored. I'll just pull it and take to a shop and have them check it all out.

-Kevin

Posted on: 5/28 10:55
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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Ross
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I'm betting on the drum rubbing on the edge of a brake shoe. Bearings do not squeak; they rumble

But before you even do that, whilst the vehicle is up on stands, grab a wheel and pull it in/out. Can you feel any axial play? If you can, it is too much.

Posted on: 5/28 12:16
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Re: KPack's 1954 Panama
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DavidPackard
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Kevin:
I was thinking of taking my ’48 to a shop to have the rear end worked on. I specifically asked the mechanic on how he dealt with the shims, and his remark was ‘What shims?’, at that point I decided to do the work at home. Be cautious in selecting ‘shops’ to work on a 70 – 80 year old design.

Remember you measured the bearing clearance with feeler gauges before you re-assembled everything, and you had an acceptable number. Was it the measurement process you think an error could have been made?

I’m still skeptical about a bearing making a squeaking noise, especially one that you know has a good amount of fresh grease. I was just looking at the cut-away drawing of the rear brake, wheel, and axle bearing lay-out. I was quite surprised how close the outer most oil scupper comes to the outer diameter of the hub. Assuming a bit of oversized bolt holes in the outer shield I could imagine a bit of rub.

I’ll second BigKev’s remark about being on the lookout for witness marks. Also before the disassembly try to set-up a pointer close to the lathe center in the end of the axle (cotter pin removed), and see if you can detect a difference in axle ‘wobble’ one side to another. This pointer could be nothing more than a wire coat hanger and a few cement blocks. Nothing fancy, just a qualitative comparison.

The bearing clearance can be verified with everything assembled. The trick is where the measurement ‘stuff’ attaches. Think about some angle stock ‘C’ clamped to the leaf spring, or a dial indicator attached to a sizable mass positioned near the brake drum. Again both wheels removed, a helper pulling on the other side, and you pushing and pulling your side while taking the measurements.

Ross’s comment about the edges of brake shoes touching the drum is right ‘on point’. There’s one brand of old cars that uses the same tapered axle design that runs into that situation often. For that car there are aftermarket sheet metal shims available that fit between the axle tapper and the hub that effectively pushes the drum out board. I would think a bit of a bend in the backing plate would push a shoe out board, and that’s not a lot of clearance to begin with.

I’ve lost track . . . Is the noise coming from the side that had the ‘drum wobble’?

dp

Posted on: 5/28 12:53
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