Packard Forum Index » Pre-War (1899-1942)

In the book Magnificent Packard Twelve, by Ed Blend, page 73, he states:
"Seldom seen today, the cloissone hub cars on the V-12 were available in black, with or without legend, with green used on some special orders"

Anyone ever seen an orig black or green or do u think this is one of those HE SAID - SHE SAID ???????????

Believe the JAPANESE Embassy PACKARDs had blank cloissone caps. About 10 yrs back someone repoped some in green and guessing they were hanging their hat on this statement.

I've seen green cloisonn? though they were restored so no actual proof but the owner claimed the originals were green, picture attached. I've also seen one without the legend or lettering, just plain red cloisonn?, unfortunately I didn't have a camera at the time.

I once asked Turnquist about the green cloisonn?, he sort of mumbled a yes. Not that he was always the oracle of correct information; wonderful as his book was it's filled with errors. Here's where he is now if you want to ask him (no disrespect intended).

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I've seen black on a 37 Twelve limosine. They were all black with no advertising.

I know the pontoon car has green on it. That doesn't much bother me because the wheels are correct for the car, the hood ornament is original, and the Packard radiator is original. I don't think the car came with a green top and if they can't produce an original hubcap medallion in green then that story is probably baloney. But it's not a bad grade of baloney. Even though I don't think the top is original color and the medallions are questionable I'd go easy on those two aspects. But there are some other cars I knew when they were original and when I see what happened to them in the name of "Rabble Beach" I want to throw up.

If I'm judging Packards and I'm faced with a car that is done authentic I'll go pretty easy on the scoring. But if I'm looking at a million dollar trailer car with all sorts of modifications that I know weren't on it in 1934, I'll get grumpy.

People take a lot of pot shots at Turnquist. And I know why. However, on a percentage basis, I don't think his book is that much more inaccurate than the others. And there are some real whoppers out there. I do not understand why Bob called the pre 1932 384 ci eights "Big" eights rather than Custom Eights. However, that book has a lot of photograhps that are very meanignful to anybody who is interested in authenticity. A high percentage of the cars in that book are original. I remember some of those cars from way back. For example, the 840 phaeton with the black top (originally tan) had its original interior. That was a beautiful car and that picture takes me way back. If you look very closely you will notice it has 9th series hubcaps on the spares. Someone I knew had the hubcaps he needed, but they wouldn't trade even. They got into a nickel and dime argument and nothing happened. Today 8th series hubcaps are like gold and somebody has them.

The restored dark green 1938 Twelve convertible sedan in West Virginia has green cloisonne medallions on it too. I don't believe it did originally though.

I guess these customized hubcaps are the latest modification craze. Another thing going on is painting the hubcaps to match the body color. Why not paint the engine in a coordinated scheme picked out by Martha Stewart?

I don't see the Cadillac owners making up this kind of stuff.

TIM - Know the provenance of the '37 Limo with the BLACK Clos. ??

The restored '36 Ph. of the JAPANESE Embassy NO NAME Clos. r in red and guessing restored. Now wondering if they were orig black. Cars restored to a yellow paint which i question for an Ebassy car so now wondering about the Clos color.

BTW: Some Hub Cap rings as well as around the PACKARD EIGHT & SUPER did have Whl. or Body color. If u go to the PARTS BOOK and look at the caps they state SPECIFY COLOR. Some period photos of light colored cars show the cap rings & in the light color but have found some light colored cars with dark ring & that im guessing were vendor black. Never know but im thinking that if the striper was not busy they had them do caps - if busy FORGETABOUTIT and get the car out of the door.

http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMTYzNTAwMDM5NF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTYwMjg0MDI2._V1_.jpg

The 37 Twelve I saw in 1972 at Pocono Manor. It was just there at a show.

I've seen a lot of original hubcaps in my day and they were all the same darn color. Once Bill Hirsch started selling new ones there were boxes of old dented hubcaps lying around.

I was looking at the parts book and I think they made a mistake. There is a whole mixed up bunch up parts relating to the seldom seen disc wheel option. They have the same nonsense in there about the radiator shell, yet I've never seen a period picture of a factory eight cylinder with a painted shell. As well the color options chart says nothing about painted radiator shells and painted hubcaps, yet it does specifically list contrasting hood doors at extra cost. I found one recent picture with what may have been a painted shell, but it also had painted louvers.

If someone can produce a sales slip for this stuff I'll change my opinion. The Cadillac history is complete enough to demonstrate special orders for Fleetwood with things like painted headlights and windshield frames, but those are the exception.

I rarely see an authentic Packard. Every original 1940 160 convertible coupe I saw years ago had crank vent windows. The last time not a single restored car had them. What does that tell you?

I think these Packard historians are just making up crap.

As an example, I knew this guy - Charlie Clancy - and he had a 37 Super 8 Convertible Sedan - Dietrich. He bought the car in the 40's. It had the body tag because it was a special order. It was baby blue with blue leather and Bedford cord on the interior. It had wood window trim as well the same as the Twelve. The car still had the original interior and the original color. The hub caps were plain old Packard without any special painted hexagons or whatever.

Cant remember who said it
"PACKARD Factory is nothing but one big Custom Car Shop"

-Got a friend in Wash state with an 1100 that had orig green when he got it and it had the green on the caps.
-Theres a 1200 a few miles from me thats orig green with green caps.
-Somes caps on ebay a few months back in red.
-This photo:
http://www.classicmoviefavorites.com/classicmoviefavWP/photogallery/albums/userpics/10001/1935packardmw.jpg
-http://cdn.silodrome.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/1934_Packard_Super_Eight_Convertible_Victoria.jpg
-http://www.ebay.com/itm/1933-Packard-Exhibit-Factory-Photo-Milan-Auto-ca2279-/371342333280?hash=item5675ba5560:m:mQwNjyWrYc0XukNptk3cKkw

Trouble is most of the cars were black or dark so its hard to nail down this stuff in Black & White photos. There is a period KODACHROME ad photo of a '33 12 CR showing the cap rings in yellow.

Interesting photo of the '36 Super Eight. Even the bumper insert is body color. (Yes, I know the link says 1935, but pretty sure it's a '36.)

"Interesting photo of the '36 Super Eight. Even the bumper insert is body color."

Standard for '35/6 EIGHT & SUPER



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