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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#21
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Max
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Quote:

DavidPackard wrote:
Max;

I like your car . . . care to trade?

Your vehicle model information of 2275-9 xxxx indicates a 22nd series automobile sold in 1949. As Ross indicated that model designation is for a Super Eight Club Sedan. See the Model Information section of this site for more detail.

You have just a bit of 23rd series trim installed . . . be not anywhere near a ‘Frankenstein’ car. Look in the Model Information section, specifically the 23rd series entries. I think you will find the upper fender spears that are likely installed on your car.

Go back to the 22nd series and look at any model with the word “Custom”. That’s the trim near your rear tail lights. The lights appear to be correct. Navigate to the Photo Archive section and select 22nd series. There will be many examples of the Custom trim near the tail lights . . . and the trim for the Eight and Super Eight models. It looks like your car has Eight/Super Eight trim on the trunk lid, and Custom Eight trim at the tail lights . . . no big deal . . . don’t break-out the torches to storm the castle. Given the sales numbers for the 22nd series that trim could have been installed by the dealer at the direction of the soon to be the proud owner. By mid 1949 all of the parts on your car would available over the Packard parts counter. Consider that the front fenders could have been changed 70 years ago, for some other reason, and the problem statement was nothing more than ‘Do I fill the holes, or install the different trim?”.

Now for the photos you initially posted; I see a few blue hoses on the left side of the engine bay, and a bracket holding a hose end close to the battery . . . What are those? Something to think about when the weather tempers your driving enthusiasm; 6 volt cars do much better with stout battery cables, with crimped, or better yet soldered ends, and I believe ‘all black’ insulation was the standard for both cables. Also if you have a photo of the front of the car showing the details of the grill and bumper please post.

dp


Hello

I have no idea what those blue cables are, including the one that ends at the bracket you noted. I will have to inquire.

Added front end pictures.

FYI, I lived in Scottsdale (actually Desert Ridge Area) for 2 years. I’ll probably be there in July sometime for a few days visiting a friend.

Thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge.

Max

Posted on: 6/30 21:05
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#22
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Max
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Quote:

packardsix1939 wrote:
Max. Good luck with your car. Hope you get a lot of enjoyment out of it and hope you found the information in my posts to be of interest. If you could post some pictures of your interior, I could take a look and see how it compares to the Super 8 I owned all those years ago.


Hello

Added some interior pictures. Clearly the seat materials are not matching yours which was original at the time. I wonder if the door cards are correct?
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and pictures.
Max

Posted on: 6/30 21:08
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#23
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packardsix1939
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Max. Your interior upholstery pattern does look correct. I think the fabric is the issue. For a really concours restoration, it should have been done in tan wool broadcloth. Can't tell if your interior is leather or vinyl, but I wouldn't worry too much. It does look nice. You have the correct chrome moulding on the door panels and these are frequently missing. Woodgrain on the dash and garnish mouldings looks good too. Somebody put a lot of money and effort into this car. Nice plastic on the steering wheel. I'm thinking it must have been recast. This can cost over $500. The plastic on my wheel was falling off and the driver side door panel was pretty much gone. So yours is way ahead of where my Super 8 was. Just drive it and enjoy. Best of luck.

Posted on: 6/30 22:04
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#24
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MJG
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Quote:

packardsix1939 wrote:
Nice plastic on the steering wheel. I'm thinking it must have been recast. This can cost over $500.


I'm not so sure it was recast. Look closely at the spoke to rim intersection. I see a hairline crack and the chrome pads absent on the spokes. Thinking a brown wheel was painted. Don't get me wrong a nice job, but I'd be putting my money on painted vs recast.

A very pretty driver quality car.

Mike

Posted on: 7/1 6:34
1948 Custom Eight Victoria Convertible
Others:
1941 Cadillac Series 62 Deluxe Convertible Coupe
1956 Oldsmobile 88 Sedan
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#25
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MJG
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Just looked at the pictures a bit better. Am I the only one seeing massive cracking in the top of the driver's side fender (Look at the engine bay photo)? Unless that's an optical illusion of some sort looks like some massive Bondo cracking to me. If so I'd go to town on this car with a magnet and be testing paint thickness. Looks like someone undercoated the hood too.

Mike

Posted on: 7/1 9:07
1948 Custom Eight Victoria Convertible
Others:
1941 Cadillac Series 62 Deluxe Convertible Coupe
1956 Oldsmobile 88 Sedan
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#26
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packardsix1939
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MJG: Good catch on the steering wheel in Max's car. I took another look at the interior photo and expanded it. Obviously, someone painted a Standard wheel white and added a decorative touch to the spokes. The correct wheel for a Super 8 would be white Tenite plastic with the chrome spoke ornaments. If you expand the picture I posted for my old Super 8 convertible, you will see the correct wheel. I believe that this was referred to as the Deluxe steering wheel. It was standard equipment on Custom 8 and Super 8 cars but was optional on the Standard and Deluxe 8 models. The Standard wheel was brown hard rubber with no spoke ornaments.

The big problem with the Deluxe wheels is the warping and cracking caused by the natural deterioration of the plastic. Tenite was an early plastic and while widely used in cars of the period, it is unstable and is easily degraded by heat and sunlight. The plastic on the wheel on my Super 8 Club Sedan was literally crumbling off of the steel core when I purchased the car. My Super 8 Convertible had a Standard 8 wheel that had been painted white, just like Max's car. I found a Deluxe wheel from a parts car and had it recast. It cost over $500 to do and this was about 20 years ago. No idea what it would cost today. Also, I had to wait months to get it.

One thing to note about the steering wheels in 22nd and 23rd series cars is that the same wheel was used through 1954. And I think that at some point, Packard started putting the chrome spoke ornaments on all of the wheels. I had a 1954 Clipper Club Sedan around the same time I owned the '48 Super 8 convertible and noticed that the Clipper's wheel also had the chrome spoke ornaments. And it was a painted hard rubber wheel, not Tenite plastic.

I don't think I'd bother to change the wheel in Max's car for authenticity. It does look nice the way it is. The plastic center on the horn ring looks much better than what I typically see. Often, the plastic has crazing or cracking in the surface. I've seen some really bad ones over the years.

Posted on: 7/1 11:03
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#27
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Max
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Hello All

First, I would like to thank each and everyone of you that have been providing info, feedback, help and stories. It is very much appreciated.

Got a picture of the engine block with serial number today. I am curious of two things.
A - how do I know if this engine is the original to the car? Is there a database that Paris the engines with the car VIN? Or is this on the vehicles data plate which stupidly I forgot to get a picture of but will request it.

It was mention that the engine air filter canister is the incorrect one and that it shoddily be horizontal. After plugging in the engine # on this site I get a picture with the air filter canister style that appears to match the upright one currently on this car. PLease see picture below.

For the blue wires on the front to the left of the radiator, I still do not know what those are but also have not yet asked the owner.

As for the “cracks” on the front driver fender. I am not seeing it. Will look again. Are you referring to the top fender area to the right of those blue wires? If so from what I gather, that is a reflection from the above tree branches and power/phone/cable line wires.

I see what you are all saying about the steering wheel. It is missing the chrome trim thus showing the black under area. I had though the contrast looked nice but would prefer to have it correct after ownership. Will search for the chrome trip parts and hopefully is can be added back onto the wheel.
I also see the crack mentioned and after some closer looking it does appear to have been painted to renew the wheel. The other parts are nice. I don’t mind the wheel having been painted to refresh the appearance as long as period correct and does not look sloppy. I have a curse for seeing imperfections in paint. I usually cannot own a car that has had one panel repainted, new or classic, I always see the variation in shade. It’s a curse not a gift.

I also noticed the black trim around the shift lever to be cracked, hope that can been replaced.
Happy 4th of July to all!

Thank you

Max

Attach file:



jpeg  B40A4E22-9DC7-47C5-B86A-88CC09036770.jpeg (1,165.46 KB)
225627_62bf4f9a61151.jpeg 1333X1702 px

Posted on: 7/1 14:48
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#28
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MJG
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Hi Max,

Your description of tree branches could very well be what I'm seeing there. If you aren't going to look in person, might want to request another photo for peace of mind though.

I don't think you can modify that wheel with chrome pieces. I once had one of the base model wheels and noted the brown wheel had that potion of chrome actually cast in rubber where the ivory wheel had a section cast to accept the chrome piece with two pins. I'm not saying it's impossible, but think you'd be better of just replacing with the right wheel if it bothers you.

I do think that is a Packard air cleaner though I'm not 100% on application between models. I think the long one was an accessory??

What I did to confirm my car/motor: Confirmed the patent plate was original and close to the Brigg's number (identical for mine). Made sure the motor number was somewhat in-line with the delivery date. Looked at the head casting date (it was cast three weeks prior to delivery). Finally, looked the motor over very close for evidence of wrenching/removal. In my case I had near 100% confidence it was original and untouched. To my knowledge there is no way to directly confirm a motor number was installed in said car. Ohers on here know a lot more than me though..

Good luck with the purchase!

Mike

Posted on: 7/1 15:13
1948 Custom Eight Victoria Convertible
Others:
1941 Cadillac Series 62 Deluxe Convertible Coupe
1956 Oldsmobile 88 Sedan
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#29
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PackardDon
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There is no way to know if the engine is original to the car but with what you have you can confirm that it is the proper one for the car. Some Packards, such as Henney-Packard commercial chassis, have the engine number stamped on the same plate as the vehicle number but even then, not all had it. If your car still has the build sheet (sometimes tucked above the glove box or under the back seat) it may have the number but I’m not sure.

Posted on: 7/1 16:02
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Re: Advice from those in the know on 1949 Super 8 Coupe
#30
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packardsix1939
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Hi Max. I have some more info and pictures for you.

The long, horizontal air cleaner was standard on the 327 CI Super 8 and 356 CI Custom 8 engines for the 22nd and 23rd series Packards. This air cleaner assembly was also used on 1951-1953 Packards with the 327 CI engine, typically found in the 250, 300 and 400 (Patrician) series cars. I once had a 1951 Model 250 equipped with the 327 CI engine and it had the same air cleaner as my 1948 Super 8.

Below is some material from a period sales brochure for the 22nd series Packards, as well as engine compartment detail photos showing the correct air cleaner assembly. I also found a close up of the steering wheel from my old '48 Super 8 Convertible Victoria. This is what a proper restored wheel should look like, with the plastic recast and the chrome spoke ornaments in place. If you want a wheel like this, I'd try to find a replacement that has the chrome spoke ornaments and repaint it white. The spokes may be easily pried off as they are held down by pins. Any '51-'54 wheel will work as all of these had the chrome on the spokes. In fact, the wheel in the photo of my old '48 was actually taken off my '51 for recasting. The wheels were identical. I believe that your wheel with the molded pattern on the spokes was only used in 1948 and it cannot be adapted to apply the chrome spoke ornaments.

There are several Packard parts vendors who have cars to part out and one of them must have a spare steering wheel or the air cleaner assembly. I'm thinking David Moe in Washington State or Bob's Packard Parts in PA. I've done business with them both over the years and they are great.

Attach file:



jpg  1948 Packard brochure_cover.jpg (147.08 KB)
225503_62bf67e101dd9.jpg 1309X953 px

jpg  1948_SuperEight_brochure_ClubSedan.jpg (264.50 KB)
225503_62bf67ee5b9c1.jpg 2608X943 px

jpg  1948_SuperEight_brochure_engine details.jpg (435.49 KB)
225503_62bf67f94bbb3.jpg 2608X943 px

jpg  1948 Super 8 Engine compartment_1.jpg (790.99 KB)
225503_62bf681d81bd0.jpg 2048X1536 px

jpg  10507472-1948-packard-convertible-std-4.jpg (105.34 KB)
225503_62bf684aad639.jpg 1280X960 px

jpg  10507467-1948-packard-convertible-std_1.jpg (145.33 KB)
225503_62bf68597b448.jpg 1280X960 px

Posted on: 7/1 16:46
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