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359 questions
#1
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Wat_Tyler
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It appears that all of the 359 equipped cars were standard with automatic transmissions. Suppose a person were to want to use said engine with a manual transmission. Would parts from a 327 stickshift - flywheel and so on - fit? Howzabout a 288??


Has anyone ever done this?


Asking for a friend . . . . ;)

Posted on: 9/4 15:35
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 359 questions
#2
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HH56
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You would need to replace the bellhousing and anything else associated with the stick shift. To find everything -- in particular the small pieces in linkage and steering column -- it would most likely take a parts car. Like changing the 55-6 Twin Ultras to sticks, I am sure it has been done several times on the earlier models.

One issue with using that large engine might be the clutch size. I did not check the parts book to see what was available so you might do that. Prior to 51 all the more senior models with bigger engines or weight had a larger diameter clutch and pressure plate assy to contend with the higher torque and hp engines. I am not sure if the practice continued after that so unless the parts book specifically states there was only one combo, torque and clutch slip might be an issue with using 288 components on a 359 engine.

Posted on: 9/4 15:48
Howard
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Re: 359 questions
#3
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Wat_Tyler
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I'm not all that sure - wait, I'm not sure at all, so let's try again. I am familiar with the whole business about different clutches and such in the big engines before they dropped the 356. I have several of those. And they are elephants. I'm trying to do something straight eight and lose a few (hundred) pounds by using the 359 instead. And that is a closer-to-square engine while retaining the 9 main bearing design. I'm of the impression that the 359 block is maybe closer to the older 327 9-main block, so some of that stuff might should swap.


I do already have a 327 9-main engine, but it was a slushbox engine and has a flex plate.


But come to think of it, the 9-main blocks were all in the seniors and would oftentimes likely have the auto-trans, I'm guessing.


Thank you, Howard, for always chiming in on questions like these. I not only appreciate your input but your whole tone as well. You're upbeat and helpful, and you're both a wealth of info and a good navigator of this website, too.


Food for thought . . . .

Posted on: 9/4 16:02
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 359 questions
#4
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HH56
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Thanks. Not sure what engine or model you are thinking of the replacement for but in 53 Packard issued an article on replacing the 356 with a 9 main 327. There were also a couple of followup clarification articles.

If you are doing something on one of your Clippers -- even if it is the 282 -- there might be some pertinent info you could still use in the article when fitting the later engine. The 359 was a bored and stroked 327 9 main so the basic block is the same. https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/downloads/SC/SC-VOL27NO7.pdf

Posted on: 9/4 16:27
Howard
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Re: 359 questions
#5
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Wat_Tyler
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Quote:

HH56 wrote:
Thanks. Not sure what engine or model you are thinking of the replacement for but in 53 Packard issued an article on replacing the 356 with a 9 main 327. There were also a couple of followup clarification articles.

If you are doing something on one of your Clippers -- even if it is the 282 -- there might be some pertinent info you could still use in the article when fitting the later engine. The 359 was a bored and stroked 327 9 main so the basic block is the same. https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/downloads/SC/SC-VOL27NO7.pdf



That, my dear man, is the Missing Link in my Think(ing). Now it's just a matter of sieving through the parts book and finding what will fit where.


Gonna need a flywheel for sure.


And yeah, this is for the Clipper 6. It should beat the pants off a 356 when all is said and done. The 356 may have been The Engineer's Engine, but she's a porky lass.

Posted on: 9/4 16:38
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 359 questions
#6
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Owen_Dyneto
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To answer one ofthe original questions, yes quite a few have added standard shift transmissions to 359 engines. I've not participated in such a job myself but I've been told its straight forward and simple, especially if you have a suitable donor car with all the required parts. The one conversion that comes to mind immediately is the ex-Ole Book 1953 Caribbean with 359 and standard shift.

Posted on: 9/4 16:51
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Re: 359 questions
#7
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HH56
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I guess if a 282 will fit on the shorter wheelbase so will the later engines. I would still check if the longer engine will mount in place of a six without some fabrication. Prior to 51 the different wheelbases were done ahead of the cowl and sixes on the short wheelbase might not have a lot of room without moving something. Also would wonder how the springs will take the increased weight.

Posted on: 9/4 16:52
Howard
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Re: 359 questions
#8
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Wat_Tyler
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Quote:

Owen_Dyneto wrote:
To answer one ofthe original questions, yes quite a few have added standard shift transmissions to 359 engines. I've not participated in such a job myself but I've been told its straight forward and simple, especially if you have a suitable donor car with all the required parts. The one conversion that comes to mind immediately is the ex-Ole Book 1953 Caribbean with 359 and standard shift.



Thanks for that tidbit of knowledge. It just didn't seem like it should be that huge a deal. But thinking has gotten me into more trouble than a little bit. I have learned how to ask for help here in my declining years.


;)

Posted on: 9/4 17:21
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 359 questions
#9
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Wat_Tyler
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Quote:

HH56 wrote:
I guess if a 282 will fit on the shorter wheelbase so will the later engines. I would still check if the longer engine will mount in place of a six without some fabrication. Prior to 51 the different wheelbases were done ahead of the cowl and sixes on the short wheelbase might not have a lot of room without moving something. Also would wonder how the springs will take the increased weight.



Actually, it all seems to be a matter of having the proper parts to swap about. There is that thing in there at the radiator. Appears to be a type of support. I don't know what it's called, but for the sake of this discussion, it's a halo. On the six, the radiator mounts behind it. On the 8 (282 SWB models), the radiator mounts to the grille side of it.


I'm fortunate in that I have a '47 6 coupe, a '47 Deluxe coupe, and the '46 Deluxe sedan. So I can stare at them for hours at a time and study what's different about them.


I'll write about it as I discover things. Which reminds me, I need to take out a couple of fuel tanks and get some measurements.

Posted on: 9/4 17:31
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 359 questions
#10
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PackardDon
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The 359 and 327 were more or less the same engine with a different bore and stoke and as far as I recall, all external parts will interchange between them. Keep in mind, though, that the 359's 212 hp rating was based on the aluminum head and those are hard to come by, most having been long ago replaced with one or the other of the cast iron heads.

As for as a manual transmission on the 359, I believe the Ultramatic was optional on the senior 1954 Henney-Packards which came standard with the 359 so obviously without the option, they would have been manual. Since these coaches weighed close to three tons and some even over (my 1952 was 6,200 lbs), just check the parts book for a clutch for a 5413 and see what else it fits.

Posted on: 9/4 21:47
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