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I have a 1937 Packard 115c. I would like to install seat belts for the front bench. I would some guidance on the best place to attach them. The seat belts are just lap belts.
Thank You- Randy

I have seen some of those installations and they are not good. For one the belts need to be anchored into the chassis, or at the body mounts which is not available for the center point. Fortunately, Packard used the X-frame which makes that possible.

Next, the seat mountings need to be reinforced because in a serious crash they will fly forward. When that happens, you are experiencing a rear end type collision. As well, if the body mounts are in poor condition the whole thing might break loose.

The third consideration is you should consider a three point system to prevent being injured by the steering column. I knew someone who crashed his modern Lincoln Town Car and was wearing a three point belt. His chest was still crushed and his health went downhill afterward. He lived, but not very well afterward.

And finally consider that when those cars were built the average road speeds and traffic conditions were much different than today.

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In addition to Tim's suggestions, if your seat has the solid enclosed frame like Packard used thru at least 1950 it may be necessary to add slots in the seat frame back so the belt will have a straighter approach to any anchoring points behind the seat. In most, if you try to come up thru the bottom and fold around the cushion, there will be sharp bends and maybe sharp metal that could stress the belts. In addition, if the seat or cushion should lift during an accident, straightening of any bends in the belt could result in enough slack that the belts would be of little value. In a 37 seat, if there is limited adjustment and a more or less straight route down you might be able to secure them under the seat frame but if you do try to go under I would wonder about the strength of the floor because of the battery opening.

If anchoring behind the seat, there will probably need to be some kind of compromise in floor location. For maximum strength you want the straightest approach possible to the anchors yet not be so far back the rear seat passengers feet would be competing for space or getting caught on exit. Also not too close to the seat so the anchor is under the frame and bends the belt when the seat is all the way back. Chances are you will not be able to catch any of the chassis frame to attach anchors so any location will most likely be in sheet metal. You will need to add a plate or large fender washers under the floor to spread the point load.

Here is a photo Mike took of his 47 showing his straightest belt approach and another photo of a seat frame showing how slots were cut in the solid back. The sharp metal edges in the slots were covered with nylon edge strip to avoid belt damage.

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G'day REByar,
to PackardInfo, I invite you include your '37 Packard 115c in the Packard Vehicle Registry.

Topic moved to Pre-War Forum

REByar,
for including your '37 Six Business Coupe in the Packard Vehicle Registry.

I have a '37 115c as well.

I drilled through the floor and used the reinforcing plates that came with the belts, as well as a larger strap plate for each passenger that I made out of 1/8" steel. That was a PITA on my drill press, but better than bolting through sheet metal.

Three point would have been superior, and I might do that on my '40, which will probably end up a less faithful renovation to get her back on the road than the stock '37 115c.

I installed front three point belts and rear lap belts in our 1935 1205. Each front belt has an upper torso harness which joins behind the seat to a single detachable tether and the tether is attached to a belt retractor mounted in the trunk behind the rear seat. The rear belts are lap only.

For shows, the retractable belt can be detached from the front harness tether and the belts hidden under the front seat. The retractable belt is then wound up behind the rear seat with only the end of the buckle visible. The retractable mechanisms are mounted near the center of the car such that they do not interfere with two rear passengers when they and the front occupants are belted in.

The fronts are mounted directly to the car frame under the wood floor boards. The rear laps are mounted to a 2x2 steel angle with welded closed ends fastened with through bolts to the frame side rails. The retractable tether mechanisms are bolted to the steel floor in the trunk with the large washers supplied with the belt hardware. A slot is cut in the trunk panel behind the rear seat to allow the retractable portion of the belt to pass through.

The retractable mechanism allows the front seat occupants freedom of movement while still being strapped in in case of an accident.

Purists might criticize this installation but I have done my best to keep myself and passengers as safe as I can while still being able to hide the belts when their presence would be objectionable. I have also mounted three point retractable belts in our '31 Chrysler sedan, '31 Model A roadster and '36 Auburn boattail speedster replica

I have some photos of the installation, but have tried several times to post them here, even reducing their size to no avail. The photos seem to have been uploaded but do not appear when the preview button is selected so I guess they are not really uploaded. Suggestions?

Glen

If loading only one photo, try editing your post and select a photo. You can then press the Upload button but for only a single photo, pressing the Submit button will upload, resize and attach the photo. Preview might not have the ability to show images that were not already attached.