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1940 1808 Super Eight
#1
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todd landis
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I have had my 1808 up and running for over 40 years, at the moment stumped. Today cannot get it to feel like it is starting.There is fuel, I can see gas flow out of the two carburetor jets when I pump the linkage. Even tried a few squirts of starting fluid.
I think electrical. The points only have a couple hundred miles on them, but did the contact cleaner with card stock to make sure no carbon, there was a bit. Tried opening and closing the points a bit. Even tried another condenser. Working back pulled the cable from coil to distributor cap, ends full of carbon, cleaned them, went to check with an ohm meter and could get no continuity from each end. Does this cable have enough resistance so there would be on ohm reading on my meter? The electrical cables have not been touched in many years, only to clean or change spark plugs. Next step is to swap the coil? If the insulation on the cable that runs from the ignition key to the coil is broken down might that cause the car to crank but not start? 40 years ago at that time noticing the wire insulation was partially crumbling where it attaches to the coil. Thanks to everyone in advance.

Posted on: 3/12 17:36
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#2
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BigKev
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Hold a plug wire need engine metal see if get a spark while cranking.

Posted on: 3/12 17:47
-BigKev


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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#3
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todd landis
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Thank you. My wife is out of town just now, so will recruit my neighbor to assist in the next day or two. Cannot see from inside the front seat to anywhere a cable would reach. Will try the cable from the coil first. Then a spark plug cable.

Posted on: 3/12 18:39
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#4
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todd landis
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Forgot I have a cranking button device, have not used in many years. Has two alligator clips, how to hook up? As I remember when connecting the usual way only got the starter to spin, but not engage the flywheel. Many years ago someone showed me the right way, but forgot so if someone could assist, thanks

Posted on: 3/12 19:00
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#5
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BigKev
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The starter button clips can be hooked up to the two terminals on the starter. You just need to make sure the ignition is on also if you are testing for spark.

Posted on: 3/12 19:03
-BigKev


1954 Packard Clipper Deluxe Touring Sedan -> Registry | Project Blog

1937 Packard 115-C Convertible Coupe -> Registry | Project Blog
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#6
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Wat_Tyler
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Quote:

todd landis wrote:
went to check with an ohm meter and could get no continuity from each end.



That should be the problem. Replace (at least) the coil wire.

Posted on: 3/12 20:27
If you're not having fun, maybe it's your own damned fault.
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
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Joe Santana
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The one that fooled me was the contact in my overdrive relay was stuck together, cutting ignition to the distributor. If you have overdrive, disconnect the wire from the overdrive relay that goes to the low tension terminal on the side of the distributor.
Alternatively you could take the cover off the OF relay and give the contacts a tweak.
Then try starting again.

Posted on: 3/12 21:15
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#8
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HH56
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Quote:

BigKev wrote:
The starter button clips can be hooked up to the two terminals on the starter. You just need to make sure the ignition is on also if you are testing for spark.

This is probably the case on smaller engine models but need to be careful using your cranking button on a 40 and 41 with the 356 engine because if it has the Autolite starter with the 4 terminal solenoid and is still stock, the starter button wiring is a bit different from other models and years.

If the wiring is stock the starter button on a 40 and 41 with the Autolite starter is in the ground side of the starter safety circuit. You will need to verify some things before using your cranking switch.

If still original there should be a small metal jumper on the solenoid that could be painted over and hard to see or a short wire between the battery terminal on the solenoid and one of the two small control terminals on the solenoid located above the two larger terminals. Those two small terminals go to a relay coil inside the solenoid case. The other small terminal has a wire going to the starter button. Out of the starter button on a 40 will be another wire going to a fourth terminal on the voltage regulator labeled T. That terminal goes to an extra contact inside that provides the ground to the control relay inside the solenoid.

When the starter button is pushed ground gets to the relay in the solenoid and because battery voltage is already present on the other terminal, the relay works and solenoid engages so engine cranks. When the engine starts the generator and regulator starts working and opens the extra contact so ground is disconnected and the starter will no longer be able to operate until the engine quits. That is the safety circuit unique to engines with the Autolite gear reduction starter.

To use your cranking button you need to be absolutely sure the small terminal on the solenoid you connect the alligator clip to is not the one going to the battery terminal. Because the other alligator clip on the cranking button will go to chassis ground, if you connect to the wrong terminal it will be a direct short when you push the cranking button.

If you have a replacement 3 terminal regulator, instead of a fourth terminal the starter ground wire may be connected to the ARM or GEN terminal just as was done in 41 thru 1950 356 models which used the Autolite starter. In those models the ground is provided thru the coils in the generator. When the generator starts working voltage becomes present on the ARM terminal and with voltage there and the same voltage from the battery on the other terminal the solenoid cannot engage. To use the cranking button on that setup the wire to the button needs to be removed from the ARM terminal before connecting the cranking button or there could be another short when the engine starts and generator starts putting out voltage.

42 and later put the starter button or carb switch in the power side fed from ign switch and the small jumper on the solenoid was eliminated. Wile not done often, there have been some 40 and 41 cars converted so the starter button is like the 42s and is fed from the ign switch.

If issues with intermittent starting or the generator provided ground to the safety circuit developed a problem a lot of the circuits were bypassed by removing the wire from the fourth terminal or ARM terminals and going directly to ground. The jumper to the BAT terminal on the solenoid was still present on a 40 and 41.

Attach file:



jpg  40 Autolite solenoid.jpg (68.77 KB)
209_640e8653efd7d.jpg 498X356 px

jpg  40 regulator and gen.jpg (409.48 KB)
209_640e8984b2522.jpg 1848X1502 px

jpg  41 and later ground to starter safety circuit.jpg (151.30 KB)
209_640e899596d86.jpg 548X652 px

Posted on: 3/12 21:27
Howard
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#9
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todd landis
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Thanks, yes it is totally original Auto Lite. Since I did it all myself years ago, can be sure all original. Yes the four terminal.

Posted on: 3/12 23:17
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Re: 1940 1808 Super Eight
#10
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todd landis
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Will pull the cover off the overdrive relay.

Posted on: 3/12 23:18
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