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The really sad story involves the end of the war in the Pacific. While these boats were fabulous with their Packard engines, they were real gas hogs. They were engineered by Packard to produce tremendous horsepower and to perform like Fighter plane engines, so they ran on expensive aviation gas, and they only got something like 1-2 MPG! They were definetely purpose-built engines. The U.S. Navy didnit foresee any market or use for these expensive to operate boats post-war. Plus can you imagine finding someone to work on these engines. So the U.S. Navy collected almost all of them together and had a huge bonfire (their structure was made from plywood) and destroyed them. I don't remember if this was done at Pearl Harbor or at Subic Bay. Only a small number managed to survive to this day, usually in maritime museums.

There used to be a bunch of the PT boat engines available on the market for years as war surplus after the war, brand new, on skids, because the Navy ordered extra engines from Packard and they were held in supply depots as spares.

The best MTB movie ever made is "They Were Expendable". Robert Montgomery, the actor and star of this movie along with John Wayne, was actually a PT boat commander in the Pacific during several years of the war. Later on he was the Captain of a Destroyer involved in D-Day in 1944.

I have quite a few PT Boat Packard WWII ads in my collection, which I've uploaded to the website, and I'm always looking for more ads.
Jim Reed (423REED)

Jim, Another film you might enjoy, if you can find a copy, is the 1955 "The Ship That Died of Shame". It is about a WW2 Royal Navy Motor Gun Boat used after the war for smuggling. They similar to the USn PT boats and were powered by either 3 Roll-Royce or Packard engines.

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There were huge amounts of war material discarded at the end of the war especially in the Pacific. Much was abandoned on various islands and more was dumped into the ocean. It just wasn't worth while to transport it back to the US.

40 years later they were still making good money salvaging scrap off the bottom of the ocean. There is probably a lot left today.

Rusty,

A lot of aviation stuff and other materiel was buried in the southwest U.S. deserts. My father was an eyewitness to the digging of trenches with bulldozers and dumping of aviation engines, jeeps, guns packed in cosmoline grease and cetera. Given the climate and conditions, a whole lotta this stuff is probably still out there and salvageable... but it never will be. I imagine it's all still on government land. A wonderful adventure dream to retrieve it.

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Reed, I have a little bit of this historical plywood. Not many years after the war, plywood was pressure formed into wooden pleasure boat hulls--kind of the transition between lapstrake and fiberglas construction. My old '61 Trojan runabout uses this stuff extensively, and whatever kind of adhesives and wood (oak) and preservatives that they used is amazing stuff. It WILL NOT deteriorate, warp, de-laminate, or take a screw without drilling first. Stuff is amazing, and I doubt it's been made that way since WWII era. It's probably toxic as hell, but boy does it hold up. Just another example (like the internet we're using now), of the public taking swords and beating them into plowshares (or interstate highways.)

"A lot of aviation stuff and other materiel was buried in the southwest U.S. deserts."

*(edit: corrected name to 55Packardguy)
Yes 55Packardguy*. As late as 1998 i bought a case of WWII surplus oil still packed in original crate and tar paper and cosmo.
During the 70's i attended various surplus auctions. Literaly TONS of WWII surplus in crates. A freind of mine at the time bought the auction list. He claimed that there were 2wo different lists. One for "preferred bidders" and one for general public bidders.

During the 70's and 80's i often bought WWII surplus even at yard sales and fleamarkets. Not like i was really looking for it. It would occasionaly just be there.

About 4 years ago a huckster freind that does a lot of flea markets walked up with WWII C-rations still in the crate. It was coffee cake dated 1944. HE gave me a can of it. He and a few others were appauled when i opened it and ate it. It was just as tasty and fresh as the day it was made. In fact the best coffee cake i ever ate in my life.

I am fully confident that there is still a monumental supply of WWII surplus yet unclaimed to this day.

Just a quick note, mr. V8. My name isn't Rusty.

(edit: Thanks Mr. V8 )

Thought this would be an appropriate place to list some Packard records, including marine, automotive, and aeronautic. (Many thanks to Packards International for permission to post this.)


RECORDS WITH PACKARD MOTORS - FOR THE DEVELOPEMENT YEARS

1917 (Speedway record) W. A. Rader, one, two, three, four, five and ten miles at 125.43, 124.56, 124.7, 124.44, 123.7 m.p.h.
1917 (Speedway record) fifteen, twenty, twenty-five miles--110.4, 110.7, and 110.5 m.p.h.
1919 Ralph DePalma, Packard "905," one mile, 149.8 m.p.h.
1919 Ralph DePalma in "905" (records still stood in 1927), 10 miles at 144.40 m.p.h., 15 miles at 132.1 m.p.h., 20 miles at 134.85 m.p.h.
1920 Lieutenant Mosley, Verville-Packard speed plane, 178 m.p.h., winning Pulitzer race. Record for all speeds made by any human being from one to thirty miles.
1921 Major Shroeder, in Packard-designed and Packard-built LaPere plane with Packard-built Liberty engine made new world's altitude record of 34,509 feet.
1922 Motor for Navy's airship, "Shenandoah," motor endurance record, 300 hours. In same run, economy record for any gasoline motor of 0.45 pounds per brake horsepower. 1922-23 Col. J. G. Vincent, "Packard Chris Craft," records for new type Gold Cup racing boats.
1923 Corn. Harry B. Greening, "Rainbow III," new record for boats of any type, 1064 miles in 24 hours.
1924 Navy Seaplane PN-9, endurance record for seaplanes, 28 hours 35 minutes 27 seconds.
1925 Navy Seaplane PN-9, No. 2, distance record for seaplanes, 1841 statute miles.
1925 Army Huff-Daland plane, speed record for single-motored bombing plane, 130 m.p.h.
1925 Col. J. G. Vincent, "Nuisance," new record for Gold Cup boats, 49.1 m.p.h.
1925 Col. J. G. Vincent, "Packard Chris Craft II," 150 miles at 55.65 m.p.h. (Record for boats of any type at this distance.)
1925 Caleb Bragg, "Baby Bootlegger," won Gold Cup race.
1926 Victor Kleisrath, "Rowdy," six miles at 64.7 m.p.h. (Record for displacement boats, any type, one to six miles inclusive.)
1926 Lieut. G. T. Cuddihy, Boeing-Packard combat plane, 120 miles at 180.495 m.p.h. over closed course.
1926 George Townsend's "Greenwich Folly" won Gold Cup.
1927 Horace Dodge's "Miss Syndicate" won Sweepstakes and President Cup races.
1927 Horace Dodge's "Solar Plexus" won Dodge Memorial Trophy race.
1927 George Townsend's "Greenwich Folly" won Gold Cup race (second consecutive victory with same Packard motor).
1927 Lieuts. B. J. Connell and H. C. Rodd, PN-10 seaplane, two Packard 600 horsepower motors--seven world and 20 American records for duration, distance, altitude and speed with specified useful loads.


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BELLANCA MONOPLANE PACKARD DIESEL ENGINE, WALTER E. LEES-PILOT, FRED BROSSY-CO-PILOT. RECORD FOR NON-REFUELING OF SINGLE ENGINE AIRCRAFT STILL STANDS. MAY 26 TO MAY 28, 1931. 84 HOURS AND 32 MINUTES


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The Packard record stood until 1986 when the Voyager flew for 216 hours, 3 minutes, 44 seconds. Powered with two engines by Teledyne, the main pusher engine was liquid cooled, used for 216 hours, while the puller air-cooled engine was used for 71 hours. Designer Burt Rutan, co-pilot Jeana Yeager and pilot Dick Rutan. Does this mean Packard still holds the record for single engine equipped aircraft? Yes!


PACKARDS INTERNATIONAL MOTOR CAR CLUB-UNPUBLISHED WORK


Not a bad record, eh? Kind of makes you proud to be a Packard enthusiast.

For those of you who are PAC members, there is an article in the November issue of The Cormorant News Bulletin about the Texas Packard Association's donation of a PT boat engine to the Nimitz Museum.

(o{I}o)

And 55Packardguy, those various land, sea and air records of Packard power plants and probably more are given the full detailed treatment in Robert Neal's "Packards at Speed". It's still in print and a very worthy addition to a Packard library.

"...This powerful new entry onto the racing scene measured 26ft.x6ft.x2ft. and was equipped with a six-cylinder

Packard 200 Hp. engine which could achieve speeds up to 45.6 miles per hour. The racer had a white painted hull

with the words Packard and Chris Craft written in distinctive script on the sides. Colonel Vincent drove Packard-Chris

Craft to victory, defeating GarWood, who had won the race the previous five years..."





[source: www.speedboatclassics.com/chris_craft_legend.htm]