Dave, that's kind of what I was thinking. Hopefully we can finish the machining soon. It's really the last major obstacle.

I have a couple other things I want to run by you guys to get some answers. First up is the timing chain cover. Apparently before the engine was torn down, something sheared off these bolts from the inside.

Here's the outside, showing the four small bolts around the opening for the crankshaft:
<img src="https://oryjpq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4mEbqMGlqaCt5cuwo4e0HGlaNZdOUnicMyFDrhaa81LeZZyQWlpkGWJKxRK_NBjsibKrhGsOTnQ3bWLYrb9sQykR7LAKxjua1tDO5KVRUVBOmVRqjgd09ERyRV1zivpTPZLM_TN72lJaAb0fNPQPqMolEe42rIc2iR8d0nfx-PkzpIF6mPsM8HcKt1KIIoOXJo6qP7y6iKwoNi_CH_AkdDiw?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none" width="768" height="1024" />

On the inside the bolts are sheared off flush with the interior mounting face.
<img src="https://orydpq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4mkCwd2GBBfCK8EObzT2xLpSu5NdpvjFQZ7x4Pa9ButQ2T-p4t1ED0eaW6fhq1e4Klcbdn8ELK6V8Oa7Kx1p0eAioBEam7DMTj7DaMXETIDpCRXUF0XCUP2gRoRnEMfhxcNSDbNhrNWOOjuyjglDkwShZZwgrw6BOnBqHclOsijFZNks5ChxSYa834sdWtpUDVcG6V31IvB3dxwzHnndO4ww?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none" width="768" height="1024" />

What could have caused this?

Also, we are not sure what is supposed to go between the timing gear and the cover. We have a spacer (maybe?) and I guess there is supposed to be some sort of seal there, but there is obviously something missing around it.
<img src="https://obykpq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4mhXP3AUhWJ2A0IoHXS4AZm3-YbipvdfrR6iSSoOdmxYyQAqRC3DY1pQeSzQd9ngMr1V-cn_KwFtSQP3pZrqhRPGC45ttMijkURsBHgX9nth9FcIElsNhptfzkK1ZAEo-QMpBUTCQA2ZS92V0XmHUV6kMuU6PvmLbdrudxfQeRJ-6UIYcJ-7rODTA2AoT4SvpvqWQQnH_MwiBfwmrt4r-qeA?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none" width="768" height="1024" />

We threw a modern seal on it to test fit and it just doesn't seem right. Something is missing between the gear and the seal. And the spacer doesn't seem like it will engage the retaining pin/groove enough for it to have any sort of strength.
<img src="https://orygpq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4mbRC0SSAq0e43GylTxsNJWFQZOyWOeCjay0Nw3FYqJ3Sm8qGE5IjNyhMtrvy-KwG4oZNp0aQ-SPWaobhLQBoKn2dkKd74K6TwfBM-T4w5Tmy6GvIsYavgDLWVhvGqPbyaU1Ck9ebCSM565gmWfIw7fMpduWRwbjtayPFv8s_jBgE6r_1YypcpqKzbGcm2W2lOhRdYWBZo_tlT4B2VOlu4Ow?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none" width="768" height="1024" />

What are we missing here?

-Kevin

Noted Dave. I'll get back in there and retorque everything to correct specs. I'm not sure if I'll have the block available to put on the other side. I'll have to check.

Mal - thanks, that's very helpful. The crank still turns freely (or what I assume is freely). I torqued pretty much all of the larger bolts to right at 80. One or two probably went above that. I can certainly back them off to 70. We'll need to take out all the cotter pins and reset them, but that's not that bad of a job.

Would 10-15 ft/lbs over spec really damage the bolts? Or would I have to be far over that?

Or would it be better to just leave it as is?

-Kevin

Dave and Don, thank you both. I was able to find the factory service manual on this site after all. Turns out I was looking in the wrong place. For anyone who has trouble finding it, look under "Packard Model Info" and pull up the year and model in question. The link to the factory service manual is there.

Here's the link to the 1938 manual: https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/article/view.article.php?420

I was unable to find any Chilton's or other manuals that had any pre-war Packard information so I ended up using general torque values based on the bolt/nut size.


We finally were able to make a bit more progress yesterday. The mechanic we are working with has had a series of health issues, and we've had some problems with the upper block. Milling still isn't done on it. But we were at least able to get the crankcase mostly put together.

Short video this time:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/M7n2t9cZFuo" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

We started by cleaning all the parts that were going together. There were still a few parts with remnants of old gasket material that needed to come off. I chased all the bearing castle nuts as well.

We lubed all the bearing surfaces with thick engine assembly lube. Then sealed the lower (actually upper) half of the rear main seal by applying black gasket material to the seal, then fully assembling the rear main bearing and seal to fully seat it into place. We then removed one retaining screw at a time, applied blue Loctite, and reinstalling it and tightening. Each screw was sealed with gasket material. The other half of the seal and the main bearing were removed so the crankshaft could go in.

Next up was the camshaft. We installed and sealed the rear bearing and cap, then installed the clam shell (not sure if that's the correct term) bearing on the cam for the fuel pump. The bearing faces all got lube, then it was inserted into place, confirming that the fuel pump pin was able to fully seat and contact the cam. The front cover and plate came next.

Finally we got to the crankshaft. We carefully lowered it into place, then put all the bearings into place. All the bearings are stamped for specific location, and the stamped end goes towards one side of the engine. Once in place, we then started putting the castle nuts on. The rear main bearing took a bit more work to make sure we had gasket material where it needed to be. But it looks like all potential leak points are fully sealed (hopefully). All the nuts went on, were torqued, and cotter pins placed and trimmed.

We ran into a couple of issues that I need some help with.

1.) When putting on the castle nuts we realized that there must have been some sort of washer going on before the nut first. The engine has been disassembled for several years, so it's entirely possible that those washers were lost. Can anyone confirm that washers were supposed to go on before the castle nuts??

We ended up using grade 10 hardened washers that brought the castle nuts up to where the cotter pin holes actually lined up with the holes in the nuts.

2.) Without specific torque values to work from we used a generic table. According to that you can go up to 125 ft/lbs on the large bolts and 80ft/lbs on the small bolts. We settled on 80-90 ft/lbs for the large bolts and 60-70 for the narrow bolts. Will that work?

3.) While torquing, two of the small castle nuts totally failed...expanding and stripping. They didn't even make it to 30 ft/lbs before failing. We re-died the bolts, and used generic grade 10 nuts instead. Because they were not castle nuts we used red Loctite as an extra layer of precaution. Is this going to fly? I hate to have non-OEM nuts and bolts, but I'm thinking some modern replacement where needed is acceptable.

-Kevin

After a series of setbacks we are almost ready to start putting everything back together. We ended up sending back the water jacket because it was incorrect for the '38. The holes weren't the only issue. The overall shape was incorrect. So we'll be getting a new one shortly.

Before we start reassembling, I'm wondering about torque specs and where to find them. Is there a location where these numbers can be found? I looked through the resources here but couldn't find what I was looking for. Will I need to order a factory service manual from the Packard Club?

-Kevin

That is helpful. The hole pattern you show is exactly what ours looked like when we took it off, as well as the '37 Super 8 that was shown earlier in the thread. I'm leaning more and more towards sending the new one back and have correct holes made.

The mechanic who is helping us with the rebuild thinks that the original overheat was caused by a couple things
1. PO installed thermostat, preventing free flow of water
2. Poorly fabricated water jacket inner plate
3. Space between the water pump impeller and the housing, creating turbulence

I'll provide pictures of the damage when I'm able to. He's also concerned that the water distribution holes don't line up where he thinks there supposed to...between the cylinders is what I remember him saying is where they should be. Not correct?

-Kevin

Sorry, I should have mentioned that I have been talking to the vendor. He has this specific water jacket (the one I was shipped) labeled for '29-32. He seems to be more concerned that the outer mounting holes are correct, and less worried about the water distribution holes.

And that's where my question lies....assuming the jacket mounts properly up to the '39 block, the water distribution holes are different than what I pulled off and what another member showed earlier in the thread. I have no idea if this is a problem. The vendor doesn't think it matters much. I'm totally clueless....I've never even heard of a water jacket before working on this engine.

Ran into a bit of an issue with the water jacket. It arrived, and I'm not so sure that it's the right one. First of all, it's labeled for a '29-'32 Packard Standard 8, and I'm rebuilding a 1938 Super 8 (using a '39 block). I have no idea if the mounting holes even line up. The length is 32", so should be same as what came off. I haven't been able to test fit because the car and engine are two hours away.

The water distribution holes are different as well. Different location and different diameter. Is this a problem? Also, the water distribution plate sticks "out" from the the mounting surface. Is this how it's supposed to be? Remember, the old water jacket we pulled off was modified so I have no idea if it's right or not.

The new one:
<img src="https://pbympq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4m6kqad4uNFAmSMP6KmsGaPFC6O5F17W6iQuG-SwrkIbsftsz8Csbpvhk8C2sd7VxwLqciwWbgORQid8uIke5PNi-2YHhMFOXCd_dWGHuN6AvmHr9bXAEkEuF3JrUnh-pw_qq3x3bsj92RRoL_ff2GJ5XeyLM3eAvd2BSpEgZK0mIcpinCKclpy8hJ-yG3tHmgWvcNUwdVGFiFnehRE3V3AQ?width=495&height=660&cropmode=none" width="495" height="660" />

The old one:
<img src="https://rrxumw.bn.files.1drv.com/y4mxyrZ2slbu5MXATLNtnXsitwAylyKGH3isrlvo7WTV4jJW4HXYLmT66xMjFDh3fmXOpf9AiRx4AK-Hr-rAl0kl-HeFEC46eRPPonn4uYSScB7G2O4cvk6FEFpSkzSYVm0Ut5WCVjR7od4clovwVK8q2lWKdelFMsOuQtuJrk8XbNhYUcBjOUYI5K_p1bUD7W1ebu5xLVpaOEpb348k9iVQQ?width=495&height=660&cropmode=none" width="495" height="660" />

I guess the big question is how different is the '38-39 Super 8 block from the '32 Standard 8? I've read the whole "Packard: A History" book, but I don't remember the small details like this. And I've never seen a '32 block....

-Kevin

I spent a few hours this last Saturday prepping the last of the major components for the engine rebuild. My brother-in-law and I cleaned off all the old gaskets and sealant from all parts, and chased all the bolts with dies to clean up the threads that had been rounded off/stretched. This all took a surprising amount of time.

The block is getting the finishing touches at the machine shop this week, and the crankshaft should be done with balance as well. Then it's just waiting for the water jacket and the new oil filter and we have everything we need.

The crankcase and oil pain are going to get sent through a large parts washer to clean out the metal shavings.

Here's the underside of the crankcase with most everything in place.
<img src="https://prynpq.bn.files.1drv.com/y4m_i_GhagTjOuxajl4FQc-_2WPKFLQrxiWi2NF3LgIs3RvT9Mx_w6wkGMvltsx-eddiUJjNvrAtbHpOM5VIztcW131gboAHDNtb4etv3QSx2F5smocFW6_QdUFF4X4ed-Yasp4bto4FdRVdJoWeRp3FAMQ80Mrc0TJ_YFwidYPG6JhTlYp2gF4eF5KQH8LEsCxz-3EAgcuStpPgX1_9xQM2w?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none" width="768" height="1024" />

And if you have 10 minutes to kill, here's a time-lapse video of the whole process. I'm the guy in the light gray shirt.
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/l4A0aGE3X0E" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I've seen this car as well on Craigslist and had the guy send me some pictures. The motor was running before he got it, but he hasn't run it since due to needing to replace the wiring harness, gas tank, and fuel pump.

The interior looks like some rodents tore the place apart. I don't anything about restoring upholstery so I'm not sure how difficult or expensive that would be.

The biggest concern for me would be the rust in the trunk. It's really bad....most of the outer edge of the trunk floor is completely gone all the way around to the wheel wells. There are huge holes all over the trunk. I don't know if the floor pans would be the same. Are there any replacement trunk floors available, or would a repair like that be a complete fabrication job?

I initially was excited about checking out this car, but I'm worried that this one would be way out of my league.