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Re: 1948 Packard not starting
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
That one is right up there with leaving the rotor out in frequency.
Some have read from the casting number instead of the firing order.
Good to admit and laugh it off.
Much "run to the internet" diagnostics these daze but that's because these are "old" technology, not everyone is "old" enough, and those that are can't recall.

We were commissioning a SOA control system, early '80s. The parts were so new, beta test, they didn't have documentation yet. So the supplier engr xeroed the pin out drawing, and it was mirror image, did not check. We plug in the ribbon cable, put the juice on, and chips popped like pop-corn - dead short. Chips were new and in short supply. Bosses don't have much humor for things like that, but they occur. All ended well and on time. Learned methodical the hard way.

A friend was taking flying lessons and he was not used to a "heading" compass. On solo, he ended up nearly out of fuel, heading 180 in wrong direction and had to declare an emergency at a major airport. So don't feel bad, yours wouldn't be fatal. He got the nickname "wrong way". I did ride with him once after licensed. I figured what's the chance on the first, but never do twice what you got away with once.

Posted on: 3/24 7:30:33
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Re: 356 Marine Engine and transmission restoration question
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2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
Call the Packard Museum in Warren, OH. They have some marine engines, documents, and restore so they can probably set you
right or put you in touch with someone. PAC is another source.

Posted on: 3/24 7:05:22
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Re: 1948 Packard not starting
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
Didn't say if motor is in the car or on a stand?
Check your grounding, too.

From sound of things it's turning, spark, etc. So most likely either timing or fuel.
They'll run with most, not all the cylinders firing. New wires should work, so the connections are suspect, wrorng end clips, not engaged, etc.
If the battery is down and the starter warm, it may not be turning fast enough, but these run ~400 rpm at idle, so don't need much, but if battery is up and it's barely turning then the wiring to the starter and to and from the battery is not providing enough amps.
The carb starter has to be working or it won't turn at all - no juice to starter.
Anorher problem when they don't start is they "flood" out trying, ie, too much fuel. Once liquid in the cylinders, it's over the UFL and won't burn. So you have to let set and I like to take the plugs out and clean and dry them. So if the carbs not been touched, it could be dumping gas.
I'll give my standard speech, you check each system out first thoroughly, then when everything is right, move to starting.
Jumping in and not starting, you don't know what the problem is. Had each system been thoroughly checked, that is eliminated. More likely to fire right off. Work methodically.

Posted on: 3/22 7:05:37
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Re: 12 volt battery cables as a auxiliary engine to frame ground?
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
Proper tool for the job is always the best approach.
Jumper cables are made to jump start cars with low batteries.
Grounding straps are made to use for grounding.

if you want to cut up the cable to get a section of cable to make a strap via end clips that's your call. Again a local hardware would have large gauge wire to adapt. Frankly, for the few bucks I'd go to the part store for a ground strap and keep the cables in tact. Sell them, if not needed.

Also, investigate why you think it needs additional grounding as there maybe other issues to resolve.

Posted on: 3/17 13:31:05
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Re: Leaded Fuel Additives
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2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
I guess we need to talk periods; post war flathead and post war OHV.
High octane fuel is not necessary in a flathead simply because the compression is so low. Your '50, if stock, is flat(L-head). Octane boost was needed when they went OHV, which allowed to up the compression, which can lead to "knock"ing(preignition) with some low grade fuels. That compression change occurred somewhere around the early to mid '50s depending on manufacturer. Packard kind of hung on to flats a bit long. Of course, a quality motor with a following for it's day, but the post war market changed fast and lack of response lead to the need to merge to survive. Two factors there, the insistent control freak Packard guy and whom they merged with and the rest is history(literally). (just the facts)

The other factor, ex ambient lead pollution, negating lead was switch to "hardened" valve seats. They're a slightly different metallurgy and any engine shop would use modern materials. If you change the valve material, I'd have the seats changed accordingly. Which has to be done if they can't cut and lap them due to XS wear, etc.
As far as the ethanol record, it's an artifact of EPA anti-smog oxygenate fuels(RFG) policy. Bill Clinton made that call to "favor" ADM(who lobbied - not small farmers) over petroleum producers and used the MTBE spill/aquifer contamination in CA as "justification". Then EPA subsequently made everyone change their USTs to double wall, so go figure that one? Cart-horse. Double wall negates the need to switch oxygenate additives, but no crony subsidy $$ that way. Once they start something in the GOVT, it's like nearly impossible to stop it*. Been reauthorized ever since. That's one give away example of why we're so far in debt and deficits keep on coming uncontested. One day we'll wake up, but it'll be when our paper holders call us in, we can't pay, and no more USA.
* - eg; we still have three fully funded national clocks running.

Posted on: 3/15 17:51:20
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Re: What to do to drop an oil pan
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
What happens if you go through all that, take it off, and pan's clean?

How much gunk depends on a few things.
Does your car have a partial or no oil filter?
If there's no filter and high mileage, sitting with contaminated oil, than it's probably even worse than you think.
I wouldn't worry about it right now, if it has a filter and you just want to get running. Flush it out with fresh (ND) oil/change filter.
Depending on what you are going to do with it, if you're just trying to start, etc. you might consider alternates.
You can drain the pan and inspect first through drain hole with a fiber optic inspection camera and down thru the oil fill pipe. These are fairly inexpensive now at the Chinese tool take outs.
If it had no filter, high mileage, and you see lumps when you drain the oil, then it's probably sludged. Some of the early oil had a load of paraffins and they crap out everywhere, unfortunately, not just in the pan.
I took a lot of grief from this forum, but I filled my pan up with kerosene and let it sit overnight. I kept draining and flushing till it was clear, no solids. You want to do this cold and static and before you turn the motor by hand. Then fill back up with 2-3 qts of oil and drain once more to get the kerosene residual out. All the big stuff should be gone. You can reinspect at this point too. The galleys may still need attention, but you won't clean those with the pan off either. If one or more is plugged, you'll hear a tapping rather quickly after it starts, and shut it down.
I wouldn't run detergent oil for the first time or two. Depends on how much stuff you get in the oil after cleaning and whether or not it runs. I'd change oil after a few hours running til it's looking good and clean. Then you can use a modern oil, if you want. I'll probably get grief again for even mentioning this, but I have my proof and reasoning.
Simply burn the contaminated kerosene or dispose per local rules.

Posted on: 2/29 17:55:51
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Re: Did Roger Ailes's father work at the Packard plant in Warren, OH/
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the auto manufacturing went out of Warren in 1903 to Detroit. I don't think Ailes father would be of the right vintage for that. Based on, R. Ailes was in his 80s when he passed. Est. Born '30s, w/ father in 30s, put him born in >'00. Talk about child labor?
Packard Electric was sold to/taken over by GM in '32, so more likely there.
Another place to call is the Packard Museum in Warren but not sure if they keep this level detail. Employee records are usually confidential, so not too available.
The Warren Tribune is the local paper, but it's a shell of former self/taken over, so not sure they would have early copy to search. A library search may turn up copy, but a lack of evidence is not exclusionary. Depends if his old man was "notorious" or not to get in the news.

Posted on: 2/27 6:09:53
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Re: Autolite vs Delco ignition coil
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
https://www.vintagemoparts.com/product ... ervice-parts-catalog-pdf/ (Not publicly available.)

Cross ref guide on this site, shows two different Echlin replacement numbers one for Auto and one Delco, so a slight variation. Contact a NAPA store for details or look up part numbers online for picture/specs.

11157356 was superceded.
These were used on a number of different period cars. Have to delve into the specs to be sure.

Attach file:


pdf obsolete.pdf Size: 206.49 KB; Hits: 22
pdf 51coil.pdf Size: 165.50 KB; Hits: 15

Posted on: 2/14 7:09:43
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Re: 49 Standard 8 Uphostery
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Joined:
2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
If you want it's original fabric, then find the trim code on the body tag, and look up in the literature here.
May still need s swatch to match for fabric supplier. Usually can find by taking seat out and looking underneath for a flap to sample. May also have to clean the cloth to get true appearance.
Otherwise, whatever looks good/matches. I don't think there's a value issue, since the fabric is already shot so new will add value assuming your doing the whole.

Posted on: 1/31 7:43:38
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Re: Average cost of a paint job
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2013/7/17 6:26
From Clover, SC
Posts: 609
https://www.bodyshopbusiness.com/autom ... sh-formula-profitability/

Here's a ball park account of the percent costs for body shop. Paint is less than 10% of cost and that includes mark-up. So not saving much buying "cheaper" paint, but may save time, etc. EPA/OSHA has stepped in on VOCs, etc. and some OEM things are verboten.

Changing color "properly" is more work than just re-painting same.
I wouldn't look to change the color, unless the paint/etc. is shot anyway and need of restore. I'd look for another car with a color I could live with. They're always cheaper completely done. The other factor is once you get under the paint, you never know what you'll find, collision damage, could be a bondo queen or burgeoning rust bucket requiring lots of metal work. Not to mention pre-war and the "orange crate" work.

I can still do my own paint/body work, but unfortunately can not bank the cost savings. Most people will ask for receipts, proof, etc. if you say it has a $30+K paint job.
You can get a good paint job at some of the chain places, but check their work/guarantee before you commit. The one down the road may be better. Ie; are they liable for runs, orange peel, overspray, adhesion, etc. I wouldn't worry about saving a "few bucks" on paint, as the paint is the eye appeal and makes it stand out. They're not books, people judge them by their covers.

Posted on: 1/27 7:51:55
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