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I sometimes visit the AACA forum and see what is being talked about in the Packard forum. I see that the legend in his own mind Petey Hartmann in now posting again. The fellow that is allways braging how much better the Packard V12 was in performance and faster than any other Packards of that era.

Two weeks ago I had an interesting conversation with Ed Miller in Naples Florida who owns a 1933 Packard V12 Convertible Sedan, and who recently purchased a 1934 Packard Super Eight Convertible Sedan. In part of our conversation the subject came up about the performance differnece between the two. Ed stated that although the V12 has more horse power than the Super there was very little differnce in performance between the two cars. He said that is because of the weight difference between the two cars, being the V12 weighs a couple of hundred pounds more than the Super8. The the only difference Ed said is that you can feel that the V12 has more torque than the Super 8.

I hope that some of you out there like Eric and Brian find this most intersting.


John F. Shireman

i'd be interested in knowing the rear axle ratio difference between the 8 and the 12 in question. Quite often a high ratio rear axle can give the false sense of more power even with relatively underpowered engines. This is because most people (especial Americans) are enamoured with the 0-60 mph statistics.
My Executive with 3:09 rear axle is a real DOG 0-40 mph but in the 50-100 mph range it is an excellent performer even on steep long grades.

I'm sure most of you have read the performance test Packard used to hype the then new 356" engine in 1940 by comparing it to the V-12 which they discontinued in 1939. The 1940 car with the "new" engine won of course but there was no discussion of axle ratios and vehicle weights.

From posts I have read Ed Miller is a no-nonsense kind of guy who just states the facts. The V12 does have tremendous torque and I have read where you could slow down to 5 mph and still in high hear just mash the throttle and the car would just get back up to speed with nary a shudder. Now that is torque. Were you down south John? How did you run into Ed Miller?
Yes, I see PFH on the forum again. He was invited back! Now, I'm no dummy but I've yet to figure out why some people were dissed and censored and yet PFH gets invited back on. Perhaps someone with a little more wisdom or insight can enlighten me.
I've had a great summer so far - I found a train that has just been a rumor since 1944. I couldn't buy it, but I got the story behind it and why it was made. I love to document those kinds of facts. I also have other news on the car front which I may be able to disclose soon. The weather's nice, the 400 is running good and the future holds great promise. Now if I could only find the fountain of Ute life would be great.

All I can say is that AACA's loss is Packardinfo.com's gain. I have no use for the AACA forums, or the AACA in general after I was deleted. I ask a simple question about if it's possible to delete a persons account, and apparently mistake that I'm asking to BE deleted, and I'm gone. Personally, I think it was an excuse to "clean house". Thanks to all of us God$#%n upstarts, Petey's back. Me, I'm not going back there, no siree!

John, as for your comments on V12 Vs. Straight Eight Packards, I'd like to compare them all to a stock '56 400 or Patrician. I'd even leave out a Caribbean to make it a little more "fair". Packard wasn't bs'ing when they stated the '56s being "The Greatest Packard Of Them All".

Eric: There is never been any doubt in my mind or anyother persons that I know of, that the Packard V8 of 1955 and 1956 will out perform any Packard straight 8.

In some respects the 1956 Packard may have been the Greatest Packard Of Them All, when it came to inovation and engineering, but lacked in ohter areas. In some respects the 1955 and 1956 are probably the most problem plauged Packards ever introduced.

Eric please don't think that my last statement about 1955 and 1956 was an insult far from it. Just the way I see things.


John F. Shireman

Packard did have almost 30 years to get it right with the Straight 8. In some ways in 55/56 Packard was still shaking out any engineering issues with the new stuff in the 55/56 models while at the same time dealing with internal problems at the company. I think they did pretty well all things considered. Didnt Packard has the largest HP motor in 1956? or was that Caddy.

Chrysler had the highest HP engine in '56, I believe.

John, no insult taken, I just think with a little work, the '56 IS "The Greatest Packard Of Them All", and I aim to make mine that way.

Kev, If I can recall right I think that the Chrysler 300B had the most horsepower of any American car in 1956 at 355HP. Of course that was with a massaged hemi and twin 4 barrel carbs. I am pretty sure a V-8 Packard would outperform any of the straight eights in acceleration but not for smoothness and silent running. I can roll off the line in my 47 in 3rd gear and never feel it lug and then take it up over 100mph. Of course the 4:11 differential helps but the 290FT/lb. of torque at 1800 rpm and that massive 105lb. crankshaft also contribute to a smooth effortless take off in any gear. I had it up to 90mph last night on a quiet blacktop and she could easily have topped 100mph which is plenty fast enough for me. Give me a big straight eight anyday.