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I was admiring the 1939 Super Eight club coupe currently on Ebay when the above question came to my mind...

Obviously, the senior cars have different engines (and transmissions?), but by '39 weren't they sharing the IFS used on the 120? Did they stretch the 120 chassis/sheet metal for senior cars that year? Are there more differences in upholstery materials (e.g.) and instrument panels?

I know this is a long question, but am very curious, being fascinated with automotive history in general and Packard's history in particular (maybe someday I'll own one!...)...

Thanks!

I'll let others more familiar with this car comment in detail, but let me just comment on the sharing of IFS with the 120. When the senior cars went to IFS in 1937, it was based on the design already in use on the junior models, but they really didn't share all the exact same components. Spring capacities, rates, shock absorber valving, brakes, wheels, etc. were different, and there may have been other differences as well but I'm not really familiar with them in detail though a quick glance through the parts book should show where differences existed.

best way for you folks to understand this question is look at a Packard Parts Book.

The only REAL "Senior" in 1939 was the Twelve. In 1939, as we all know, Packard stuffed the 1924 design "baby eight" or "Standard Eight" into what was essentially a 120, and CALLED it a "Super Eight". And then trimmed it with some left-over "Senior Division" fittings.

A look at a Packard Parts Book will confirm NO parts (well, that isnt ENTIRELY true - door handles, dome lights, and I believe dome light switches will interchange) NO PARTS of the '39 Twelves will fit anything else in Packard's 1939 product line up.

It is VERY important for some people who are jealous of the Twelves, to want to say that there were similarities .

This WAS true in prior year production, when the Twelves shared the same exterior sheet metal with the other "Senior" products.

In response to your question, in 1939, again. NOTHING interchanges, as only the Twelve was the remaining "REAL" Senior Packard. If we are going to be HONEST, "Senior" Packard production ended in the summer of 1939, when the entire factory was converted over to the production of the much lighter "120" style cars. The separate production facilities for the "REAL "Senior Divison" were merged into the production of lower priced Packard products.

If you look up in this forum's product identification charts for, for 1938, for example, you will see that the 1938 Super Eight and Twelve are described as "shared the same chassis".

Of course anyone actually familiar with the technology of the REAL Packard V-12 and the REAL Packard Standard Eight (the 1937-'39 "Super" eights were in fact STANDARD EIGHTS) knows the much larger and more powerful engine, the "REAL" Super Eight was discontinued for 1937 production.

In 1939 (as well as '37-38), your Packard Parts book will show NO parts of the so called "Super Eight" running gear will interchange with the "big" Packards. Not so much as a BOLT in the suspension, wheels, bearings, frame, etc, will interchange between the two product lines. Brake drums, wheels, axles, bearings, suspension parts - all bigger and heavier on the 12's to reflect the greater weight and power.

Now - to put this all in perspective, let's remember that dramatic improvements in technology - rubber engine mounts, higher octane fuels giving us the ability to have higher compression motors, all made the big "Senior" cars obsolete. I would be the first to admit a "356" Packard (1940-42 "160/180 series) Super & Custom Clippers, up thru '49) are all around a very nice driving experience, and will "blow the doors" off anything in their price range. They sold well, so much better than the old "Senior Divison" cars did, for the simple and obvious reason they were "better" in that they were "up-to-date".

And let's also remember that Packard's entering the low-middle class price line with DAMN good cars for the money, kept the doors open.

So let's remember the bottom line - Sad to say the sales figures on BOTH the 1939 "Super Eight" and its bigger cousin the V-12, show us these products were not capable of supporting the Packard Motor Car Company.

MIDan,

Interesting question. There has been much discussion about this on the AACA website forum under a thread titled "What is your favorite Packard and Why?" The discussion delved into the 39 Super 8 question.

O_D is correct about components being similar, but not the same, Bigger brakes, springs, and so on.

Edited:

Deleted lengthy response to other opinionated reply.

Jim

G'day all, My reason for responding to this thread is that many people may not be aware that the US was in a mini-depression in 1938 and things were very tough in the auto industry, to the extent that dealers were paid $25 to smash the engine blocks of trade-ins, to generate new car sales. I consider that Packard's move to align Senior ( Super Eight" cars with the 120 lines was a decision predicated on achieving more sales in a volatile and depression tinged new car sales environment. I can see the wisdom and knowledge in both Owen and Peter's responses and can only agree wholeheartedly that the Traditional Senior line ended with the 39 Twelve BUT, the Packard tradition was held aloft ( a few rungs lower perhaps) in very difficult times by the 39 Super Eight "heir apparent". I'm sure that there were many misgivings about dropping the Twelve but the the 39 Super Eight was an excellent new generation "Senior" car. I know that I shall probably receive some flak for this but after 44 years of owning and driving Packards as my favourite cars, thats how I see it. Best Regards Peter Toet, P.S. I would still love to own a Twelve but with the Aussie dollar at its current 65 cent parity, I shall have to dig a lot deeper to achieve this goal.

Off Topic Sidebar to Peter Packard since it seems he is still trolling for a V-12. 1) Anticipation is often greater than reality. 2) Possession is 9/10th of the law. (so maybe a 1/24th or 1/43rd would suffice?) And finally, 3) Beware of Packard Trucks in Disguise.
Sincerely, your devoted junior packard owner/friend.

All interesting info, but did we really answer the original question; I think he was asking more about the differences between the 39 Super Eight coupe and the 120 coupe.

Right as always O_D, we have not really answered MIDan's question. There are very few parts that interchange with a 120. The list of what interchanges is much shorter. The obvious would be the bare body shell. The glass would interchange. The steering wheel. The basic wheelbase is the same.

Items different from 120 (from memory, many more if parts book is used):

Headlight assemblies
Wheels (size)
Hubcaps
Brakes
Shocks
Side trim
Hood trim
Door handles
Running board strips
Rubies in taillights
Trunk rack assembly
Transmission
Differential
Bellhousing
Engine
Generator
Starter
Air cleaner
Trim around front & rear windows
Speedometer
Clock
Instrument panel
Glove box door
Dash trim
Interior door handles
Window crank handles
Windwing crank handles
Carpet
Seat springs (Marshall type)
Upholstery
Door Panels

MIDan, you have to understand the 39 Super 8 ushered in the new era of Packard design and style for the future of senior cars. This is a divisive year and model. Essentially the 39 and 40 Super 8 is the exact same car with the exception of the 356 engine in the 40 (an outstanding engine). As mentioned in an AACA thread people either love the 39 Super or hate it. As an actual owner, I would say it is an ok car. Very classic design, well appointed, and very speedy with the newly introduced overdrive. The engine is massive under the hood, filling the engine compartment completely. The early engines are antiquated with some inherent design flaws. In may ways, the 120 engine is a far better design, as it was designed many years after the old 320. Bottom line, if you buy a 39 Super 8 be prepared for some that smite the car. Also be prepared for a car fraught with one year, one model only parts making this a very challenging car to maintain.

I am totally lost by these comments that people would "love" or "hate" different types or eras of Packard products. These are CARS, guys - manufactured PRODUCTS !

They and the company that created them make interesting study. I have YET to drive ANY Packard of ANY year that I didn't like for what it was. The neat little Packard Clipper 6 we had as a "loaner" while the local Packard agency did the brakes on our Super Clipper was a delight to drive. "Hate" it because it was a "dog" compared to the breath-taking accelleration of that "356"...? Geez...guys. Should I "hate" my V-12 because a SJ Dusie can out-run it ? Or because it isnt as comfortable in summer than a '40 with factory air conditioning?

To "love" or "hate" any particular Packard car ....? Because it was different than any other Packard car?

What's with that ? Sounds to me like someone needs to get hold of some copies of PLAYBOY magazine, and see what IS really important.......!

I just dont "get it".

Quote:

Pete, there is no doubt in any of our minds that you just don't "get it"