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Hi, I am having problems setting timing on my 1924 straight eight Packard engine. Can anyone give me some advice?

Thanks!

It's pretty straight-forward, what's the nature of the problem you're having?

Trying to understand the cam and crank timing with the timing chain... I have put the two dots on the cam gear with the one dot on the crank gear closest together between the cam and crank gears. But by doing this the #1 piston is not top dead center... any suggestions? Please help and a picture would be wonderful!

Thanks, Dencil

Are u putting the exact same gear(s) back onto the engine or a different/new set of gear(S)?????

Check the crank and the cam gears to be sure that the key is in place on both gears.

Have u checked the SERVICE manual for the procedure????

Sorry, when you said "timing" I assumed you meant ignition timing. I guess you meant valve timing?

Why are you assuming that when the cam marks are aligned as it sounds you've done correctly, they only align when #1 is at TDC? Without direct experience with a 2nd series Eight I'd assume you've got it right, but just to be sure you should check the valve timing. Have you rotated the engine by hand in the direction or rotation and seen the intake open on the intake stroke, both close on compression and power, and the exhaust open on the exhaust stroke? It might be nice to have a degree wheel made up and check for the exact cycle, but as long as you aligned the cam and crank marks this test sould be adequate.

Or am I missing something here?

With no authorized documentation about piston position then the assumption that #1 piston should be at TDC would be prudent assumption. The 55/56 V8 manual indicates that #1 should be at TDC for timing gear alignment. I believe that the assumption is correct at least in general engine building THEORY and most practice.

HOWEVER, very early engines such this one built in 1924 or other obscure engines could very well be the exception.

There are only 2 or 3 ways to verify the timing marks.
1. Procedure found in service manual.
2. Compare the "new" gears to the gears that were removed provided that there is evidence that the engine actualy ran using the previous gears just removed from the engine.
3. The method outlined above by Owen Dyneto.
4 A similar method as outlined by owen Dyneto using a dial indicator on the valve lift. SUch a procedure may or may not be outlined in the manual. Such a procedure IS outlined in the 55/56 V8 manual and MIGHT serve as a reference guide.

At this point we have too little information to analyze the 'problem'.

The following questions need to be answered:
1. Have u actualy ever heard this engine ever run????
2. Did u check timing gear alignment BEFORE disasembly???
3. Are the 'new gears' marks in the same position as the OLD gears marks relative to the key slots????
4. Do u have reason to believe that the gears are for a Packard engine???
5. Why did u attempt to change the gears in the first place???
6. Is this gear change part of an complete engine overhaul procedure or just a timing gear and chain replacement only???

When the timing gear marks are aligned how far (approxamately) is the piston from TDC???? Before TDC or after TDC????

If it is only 3/8" to 5/8" BEFORE TDC (NOT After tdc) then it very possible that the current setting is correct. But still questionable unless some authority or documentation can advise otherwise.

I know the 1st and 2nd Series Eights had a unique firing order, different from all later in-line Packard 8s, and I'm not sure that would make a difference but I doubt it. The earliest references I have are for the 7th series.

Packard specifications say "OOs of crankshaft and camshaft sprockets should be nearest together and line up on each side of center". Note they make no reference to piston position.

Chilton's says "Valve timing: With No. Inlet tappet set to .004 in. inlet opens 20 degrees or 6-1/2 flywheel teeth before T.C.. Marks on cam and crank sprockets should align thru the shaft centers". But they don't say the marks should align at this point of valve opening.

Assuming you've got the correct crankshaft and cam sprocket, just aligning the marks should do the trick, but then before you button it up, rotate to 6-1/2 flywheel teeth or 20 degrees before TDC and see if inlet #1 is at the opening position. I believe the cam grind is a bit different in the 1st and 2nd series, so perhaps give or take a few degrees may be of no consequence.

Sorry, wish I had some earlier references. If you really get in a bind, let me know by PM, I have a friend who has rebuilt several 1st and 2nd series Eights.

Hi, I removed the generator and had it rebuilt and unknown to me the idler gear had rolled down the chain. I reinstalled the generator and tried to start the car, needless to say it is all out of time. The car ran prior to this. The gears are the original and are in good shape. The problem I am having is if I set the two 00's on the cam gear with the one 0 on the crank gear, the number one piston is down the cylinder and the valve timing is off allot. Is this engine firing order from front to back or reverse? I have the head off and I can see the pistons and valves with no problem. Do you have any experience with the harmonic balancer? I do not have any Packard manuals. Do you know if there are any specific to straight 8 first series?

Any help is appreciated!

I do not believe the harmonic balancer has any timing marks, that was introduced many years later. There may be a "window" through the upper portion of the rear of the crankcase on the driver's side with a pointer as there was on later cars. The flywheel may be have timing marks