Packard Forum Index » General

55PGuy - nice to hear from you! Glad you liked the earlier stuff we all kick around and great suggestion on the single light. I dismissed it earlier when took a good look at the single headlight Turnpike Cruiser (Monarch in Canada, I think). Let's just say it looked best in the cover of darkness. But what you are suggesting is entirely different. Will noodle a few possibilities and try meld in your suggestion for the Clipper grill as well.

I also like the last image, would have carried forward the '56 theme but also got back to Packard's roots of simple, clean, high ticket design.

Here's an update that gives a better idea of how the Predictor theme might have looked on the TC. And well it should... I cut and pasted elements from an actual Predictor image!

Maybe this is the type of polarizing design that Packard needed for '57 to stay afloat. Hopefully they could have finessed it such that it would have turned off few and turned on many.

Assuming Ford would have required Packard to stay clear of Lincoln's turf, this car would have needed to be priced in Cadillac Eldorado territory, maybe slightly less at around $6,750. The Eldorado series - coupe and convertible - sold around 3000 units in 1957. Packard probably needed 5000 to 10,000 sales to stay afloat so the question is, how? Well, besides head turning styling with an exclusivity only the Eldorado Brougham possessed, the car would have had Torsion-Level Ride and a 440 V8 while the competition still had largely conventional suspensions and sub-400 V8 displacements.

Had Packard somehow been able to close South Bend and bring Studebaker production to Conner, even if it meant fewer Studebaker sales, there might have been a chance.

Attach file:

---

  (18.28 KB)

55Pguy - here's a rough attempt at your suggestion to use a Clipper grill and Mark II headlights. Didn't have very good images to work from. I see what you are saying, gives it a different look. Low, simple and straightforward.

Played around with the 40-42 grill theme too. The last one would fit the side view image of the TC that I initially posted. Maybe some of the front sheetmetal could have been filled in with driving, parking and/or turn signal lights.

Attach file:

---

  (22.77 KB)


  (18.23 KB)


  (20.03 KB)

Wide grill and extra wide. Last is probably too wide.

Attach file:

---

  (20.10 KB)


  (20.38 KB)

Mahoning63,

Just look at how Rolls-Roycy you're getting in the later photos! Could've really scooped the RR look that was to come.

I LIKE the single headlight version with the Clipper grill. It just is really crying out for a little more on the front of the hood... even "PACKARD" lettering similar to the '55 Seniors, but smaller and more elongated. Also, go for the circle V in the middler of the grill. I think they were onto something when the stylists (Nance, I think, concurred) that this could have been a long-term emblem like the Mercedes star. I liked the '55 style better than '56 . The less elongated "V" that stayed more within the circle was classier, IMO, and easier to place in locations like C pillars, etc.

But every time I look at your quad-headlight Clipper, I think you've got the Answer for Packard in '57. Hell, even Chevy was still selling the Shoebox in '57, carrying over from the past 2+ years (really no chassis changes from the early '50s--just like Packard, and NO new suspension like Packard could boast.).

I keep sayin', hold off a year, be realistic, and introduce the "Big New Packard" in '58.

BTW, rectangular turn signals instead of the grill under the single headlights would flesh out the front end a bit on that version. Also, the hood could have a little more slope rather than the upright "brow," although it looks pretty sophisticated the way it is.

Sooner or later, one of these designs is just going to have to be rendered in 3D, and then it's off to the sheet metal stampers.

55Pguy - thanks for the comments, will revist and tweak the image. I see what you are getting at with the argument to wait until '58, a good point re: Chevy. On the luxury end, Caddy and Chryler/Imperial made big changes that year, perhaps an argument to push through a '57 such as the Turnpike Cruiser-based theme. Not sure, would be enlightening to unearth all the details about that period. Perhaps Dwight's hoped for book might help.

Couldn't resist asking the question "what if Packard kept using Mercury/Ford body shells into the Sixties and continued to price 25% higher than Lincoln?" The result might not have been too bad based on this quick image work-up. Side glass would not have been curved but otherwise the car would have been believable. Torsion-Level would have continued to be a big selling point. Perhaps Packard could have introduced an independent rear suspension by then. I lengthened the hood 10 inches for a new wheelbase of 130. Also, the C-pillar forward edge has been moved forward 5 inches. Didn't alter anything else except the side molding but the idea would be that Packard would stamp completely unique outer sheetmetal except perhaps the front doors. One thing I didn't mention with the Turnpike Cruiser was rear legroom, which would have been good but not best in class. Same with this '61. I think Packard would have been fine with it. Look at the Eldorado Brougham on its modest 126" wheelbase. Rear legroom was "cozy" to say the least, the car basically being a sport sedan. Packard would by now be moving in that direction too, though never to that extreme. I would argue that the inches still needed to go towards the hood, as they had since the 1920s.

I just read where McNamara wanted to can Lincoln, Mercury and Edsel in the late 50s, and the compromise was that Mercury lost its unique body for 1961 to save costs. This suggests that maybe McNamara might have gone along with a sharing program with Packard in 1957 and again in the early 60s as a means of helping to improve the financials for Mercury.

Attach file:

---

  (20.95 KB)


  (20.86 KB)

have to have 2 differences of opinion - I think the 25% over Lincoln premise is rapid market death. Competitive with Cadillac's equivalent model.

The last Mercury-based one looks like a Ford (as the Mercury does) - not a luxury car. The leading edge of the headlights/fenders is very soft, no tension in the line. I'm biased becaused I never liked the styling of that car.

I think the full length trim from 55/56 is a styling theme that is very adaptable and gives the car a longer and smoother look. The long color stripe idea was used on Chevy for a while. In the tooling budget ,a different hood from the "donor" to carry back whatever grill shoulders exist is a priority (and not too difficule as it's not a deep draw.

If there's a desire to disguise the shared shell, C pillar skin changes over the same structure are also easy.

Agreed on the styling. Didn't bother trying to alter the photo on this car but let's assume that Packard would go as far as retooling all outer panels, including the front door, if it felt the effort was necessary. One area I think could have been improved on was the greenhouse, which looks a bit too tall and upright just like they did on the Ford/Mercs. Since Packard would have needed to tool a new roof anyway, unlike the earlier Turnpike Cruiser, this might have been a good opportunity to really make a dramatic change - a lower roof with new windshield and a more private backlight than the Ford/Merc and, if the borrowed door inner stampings would allow, curved side glass for more tumble home. THAT would have been one heck of a car. And let's assume the Turnpike Cruiser Packard was getting long in the tooth by decades end. Maybe 1960 was the year to introduce this new Packard, not 1961. Maybe in January 1960 at the New York Auto Show. Fresh new style for a new decade.

I agree the 25% higher pricing would have meant low volumes, just can't see how Ford would have ever allowed pricing any closer to Lincoln. The Lincoln planners would have thrown up their hands and resigned. This is why I think it might have been necessary to bring Studebaker production to Conner, or at least modify the Studebaker lines to accept large Packards. Conner probably would not have been profitable on just 5-10K Packards per year.

Packard would have been very lean in these years, barely hanging on. From 1957 well into the Sixties maybe just a single model, a sporty 4 door hardtop. Maybe a 4-door convertible too although Lincoln planners might have said no. The type of 4-door Packard being sold would have been very exclusive in design compared to its competitors, similar to what the 63 Riviera was in the 2-door market. And quality would have needed to set the industry standard. No vinyl anywhere, not a stitch. Highest quality cloths and leathers, genuine wood trim laid down sparingly and stylishly. And a 5-passenger option born of the Predictor with bucket seats and a center console.

Here's the roof lowered. Not too much, folks would have complained. Minor clean up on C-pillar too. I think the proportions were there for a really special car.

Attach file:

---

  (20.86 KB)

roof changes out of the budget! Think of the Clipper - bathtub. The main section (cowl-roof-door openings-floor pan) needs to stay common to save money. The C-pillar look can be changed with an add on piece, but the same structure is underneath. Cadillac and Imperial were still on light pillars, T-Bird/Lincoln not. Later most people went to formal heavy c-pillar. I think after the 58 Mercury, the next rebody is too much a Ford and not enough a Lincoln to share

I don't think you can go cost no object on the fittings- otherwise you end up with a Continental Mk II - 10k$, few sales and loosing money on every one.

I like the Chrysler-based approach because the drive train is I feel superior to Ford's, but I agree that Ford's styling (some Packard people did go to Ford)is more compatible.