Packard Forum Index » V-8 (1955-56)

Hi guys,

I'm ready to change oil on a 56 Caribbean I look after.

The previous mechanic used 10W-40.

The car gives off black smoke, whether the engine is cold or warm, and I want to rule out the wrong oil weight before I start looking at other causes of smoking.

What type of oil works for you guys? I couldn't find the info anywhere on this site.

Thanks,


Stephen

Black smoke is usually carburetor trouble, as the Carib 2x4 is prone to develop.

Oil smoke is blue. If the Carib is driven only in warm weather, any name brand 20w-50 will have the best additive package and prevent lifter clatter. Don't use synthetics, as their smaller molecule chains leak past old seals more easily.

thnx, jack vines

Thanks Jack.

I figured if it was burning oil as well as running rich, the blue smoke would be masked by the black.

Now I know what works oil wise, I can concentrate on the carburetion.

Thanks again!


Steve

In the last 2 or 3 years oil companies have been cutting back on the friction additives. This is supposed to reduce pollution, as the additives poison the catalytic converters in old oil burning cars.

The problem is that the new oils do not protect older, pushrod type OHV engines adequately. There have been a number of cases of rapid cam and lifter wear.

The solution is to use Diesel oil which still has the full additive package or add a high pressure additive to your oil.

Lots of opinions on oils. Here is an excerpt from a recent thread from the Studebaker Driver's Club Forum posted by Jeff Rice:

I spent a good part of today at a HD truck dealer open house plying my trade...The guy in the next booth was the senior technical trainer (ie: real smart guy chemical engineer) for Chevron Oil. I peppered him with all of the zinc of the week questions I could come up with. He has written several informative articles (without marketing hype) regarding the 'new' oils, the 'old' oils, the 'zinc' issues, and what the market is hyping to the old car folks...

Shell Rotella diesel oil... "Why in the world would anybody run diesel oil in a gas engine?"
Zinc supplemental additives: "Ask the oil manufacturer if they will stand behind their oil if you add a zinc supplement to their oil....They won't.."
Zinc 'reduction' in current oil: "Zinc hasn't been totally removed from current oils... It has just been reduced. Other compounds have been added to the oil to prevent scuffing problems.
Oil testing: The current test method (latest and greatest...I don't recall the official test number right now)is done on a Nissan flat tappet engine.
(What does this mean?)
It means that the latest engine oil sold today will NOT wipe out your camshafts or tappets.
It means that adding a supplement will not make things magically better...
It means that the engine oils marketed as 'vintage engine oils' are no better than any other oil, but are a whole bunch more expensive...
20w50 oil is fine to use in older engines, as the 20w 'cold pour point...(at 0 degree's)will be just fine in older engines. The 50 number actually 'seems' more like 30w due to the long polymer chain additive that gives it the higher number...
Gospel?
Don't know, but I asked for some followup from him to help us all out with good info... Biased info? Maybe, don't know, probably not.
He didn't have anything to gain by trying to sell me anything.
I found it fascinating...
Hope the info helps...
Jeff

Did he offer to pay for any engines that wipe out their cams?

Or, be safe, run a flathead. No cam or valve worries there.

Quote:

What?????

It's funny but back when OHV engines became really popular in the late 40s = early 50s there was a rash of valve lifter and cam wear problems. Chrysler and Studebaker V8s were known for this in their introductory year of 1951.

Now Chrysler and Studebaker were both old line car makers known for the quality and reliability of their products. But both had previously made nothing but flatheads.

A flathead engine has a very simple valve train with light springs, light parts and low pressure loads on the cam and lifters. The new OHV engines had a whole new set of problems in the cam and valve train area.

They very quickly solved their problems. In fact it was about this time that multi grade and heavy duty oils became popular. So maybe the additives had something to do with solving the wear problems.

Now all we have are OHC engines with light valve springs and pushrod engines with roller lifters. Both are very easy on the lifter and cam.

So, they take out the zinc and old flat tappet OHV engines suffer.

Well my flathead will run fine on straight run, non detergent oil without additives.

It's a funny case of history repeating.

Actually, Studebaker fixed their lifter wear problem by changing from a steel cam to a cast iron cam.

thnx, jack vines

OK I'm confused now. Hadn't known anything about the removal of zinc from our oil. For that matter I didn't know the oil contained zinc. I run a 327 with 58000 miles on it and use 10 W 40 oil right now. Should I go up to 20 W 50 ?

Bob


BTW, Changed the cam and lifters in my Dad's 51 V8 Studebaker back in 1966 because two of the lobes on the cam wore flat. Funny thing, The problem with that car didn't show itself until the plugs were changed once. The engine started firing back thru the carb. The old plug was fouled so the bad cylinder didn't try to fire. When the plugs were replaced the bad cylinder would try but with a perpetually closed exhaust valve the fire didn't have any place to go except back out the intake when the intake valve opened again. Had to pull the plug wire off To stop the firing thru the carb. That old Stude still drove pretty good on 7 and after a wile 6 cylinders.

The 51 Stude was my first drive in movie car.