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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#21
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Tim Cole
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One area that might be used as a barometer is parts. Every now and then I see a choice part on junkbay that is too good not to bid on. I need that like another hole in my head, but I go ahead and put in a minimum bid mostly to keep it from being destroyed. After all, someone might need it one day. The result is that I lose by five dollars to only one other bid. Sometimes I see the stuff back on junkbay at a ridiculous price. Of course that clown is going to die with it.

Posted on: 2020/4/12 6:21
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#22
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MJG
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Not everyone under 45 isn't interested in these cars, I'm 41 and have had my '56 since I was 15. I drove that to HS and belive it or not everyone loved it and got asked for rides constantly. I drove the crap out of that car putting ~35k miles on it through college. My father hates these cars, never understood why I liked them and constantly tried to get me to relive his teenage lust for a Camaro - never happend. The one thing that bothered him most was the amount of price gauging that happened. The couple of times I got him to go with me to Hershey (mid 90's) he would shake his head just saying "crazy." He knew that people who converted these cars into investments were creating a barrier to entry for folks like me. I no longer have that problem, nor do I care what my cars will be worth one day. If one day my cars bring a little money for my wife, that would be great but I don't think of it as an investment. I don't go on hunting trips to Colorado like my brother in-law, or have season Jets tickets like my cousin. If my cars are worth anything that's a win, but only after I've driven them accross the country on numerous tours and Great Race events - then I got my moneys worth. But I have learned a lesson and ony buy stuff now where the top goes down.
Stuff is really bad right now, but not all is lost. My company can't make enough products, and we don't make facemasks. You would be surprised to hear the goods that are still selling in high numbers. All segments are up only one divsision is down and we've converted sales from commerical to retail customers.
Anyone selling a car right now is going to get hosed. The reason why IMHO is: Who is traveling to go get one? I'm not leaving my county right now, so unless there is a buyer right there...

Posted on: 2020/4/12 7:04
1948 Custom Eight Victoria Convertible
Others:
1941 Cadillac Series 62 Deluxe Convertible Coupe
1956 Oldsmobile 88 Sedan
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#23
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Mike Grimes
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Most of the Auction companies report the results of their events. RM, Mecum, Barrett Jackson, Gooding, Worldwide, Bring Your Trailer, Bonhams, etc. To the point of asking price versus sold price, it seems that auctions are a reasonable indication of what the price might be "when the money changes hands". Condition of the car as well as its "collectability" significantly impact price. The photos on an auction website provide an indication of the condition of a car, but nothing is better than an in person inspection. I'd suggest that someone who is a "Buyer" look at the photos of these auctions and make some phone calls.

Recent 1948-1950 sales to review:

Bring Your Trailer; 1948 Super 8, 4 door - $11,250; Jan 2020
Mecum; 1948 Super 8, 4 Door - $8,800 - Jan 2020
Mecum; 1950 Deluxe 8, 4 Door - $6,050- March 2020
Worldwide; 1950 Deluxe, 4 Door - $11,865- October 2019
Worldwide; 1950 Deluxe, 4 Door - $12,100- October 2019

Then there is the C-19 virus question.

Condition?, Collectability?

One of my mentor's advice: "Don't let the thrill of the chase obscure the consequences of the catch"

Good hunting.

Posted on: 2020/4/12 7:05
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#24
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Mike Grimes
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Auction reminder; Usually the buyer pays a 10% premium, seller pays 10% selling fee; so a bidder wins at $9,000 bid on the floor; they pay $9,900. The auction website price info includes the 10%. So this transaction on the auction results website would be reported at $9,900.

The seller pays 10%, so the gross for the seller is $9,000 less 10% or $8,100. The seller must get the car to the auction. To make the math easy, $1 per mile. So for a car that is transported 500 miles to the auction site, the seller nets $7,600 ($8,100 less $500) less any detailing or other expenses, on a $9,900 reported selling price.

Therefore we have "Bring Your Trailer" and the new Hemmings internet auction sites to help both the buyer and the seller avoid the service fees of the auction process.

Of course for the seller, with an auction there's always the emotional buyer. I saw a 1970 pink VW Bug sell for $65,000 at a Gooding auction because two ladies said it was worth $65,000. Go figure.

Good luck.

Posted on: 2020/4/12 8:33
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#25
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Packard Newbie
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Wise words, all, and a good conversation that strikes at the very core of the hobby. 'Where do these cars end up, and who will tend them'??? Luckily, there will ALWAYS be folks out there who care about history and it's preservation, but as time marches on, that group will become smaller and that-preserved, more select. That's life. It's like there are still artisans out there who know how to build wooden sailing ships, but it has become a very rare pursuit. I laud MJG's young-age commitment to the era; I know my interest in pre-war Packards has been since I was a teenager, just never had the time or money to actually own one. Also, Brian's words resonate with me when you look at this as either an investment or a 'drive your money's worth' out of the car. I definitely get a lot of enjoyment out of the 'driving' part and clearly fall into the latter category. As far as the ongoing preservation of our beloved Packards goes, 'how many and how long' is a good question. I suspect the ominous future of this world-wide pandemic will ultimately play a part and it certainly isn't/won't be a seller's market, but it might be a great time to buy in for a lot of folks who wanted to, might even do the hobby some good. Who knows?!?!? Chris.

Posted on: 2020/4/12 11:06
'If you think you can, or you think you can't - you're right!' Henry Ford.
1939 Packard Six, Model 1700
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#26
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Brian Wilson
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MJG

Great to hear from you! There's hope for us yet.

Following my own advice, I recently sold my 1941 120 Club Coupe -yes, probably just in time by Tim Cole's reckoning. Still have my 1956 Clipper Deluxe (with Ultramatic!) which I enjoy driving just as much. It's a fraction of the value of the Club Coupe. But attracts the same attention out on the road - or even when parked.

Truth is it's not much to the taste of your father's generation, who gravitate towards newer cars as you said. And push the value of good ones up.

The silver lining is that the older cars are becoming much more affordable for people like you who want to drive the wheels off them! Love it.

I'm hopeful that this will lead to more of the older cars being preserved.

I have no illusions about the Clipper being an investment (except in my mental health). And my wife gives me a hard time about how much real estate it occupies in the garage. Do I feel guilty? No.

Go for it Chris! You might get a bargain. If not, there are plenty more out there. Would be good to find one needing less work (ie money) to have a nice everyday driver. Restoration work is not getting any cheaper. Although I could live with that one, especially at $1-2k.

Brian

Posted on: 2020/4/12 17:26
1941 120 Club Coupe (SOLD)
1956 Clipper Deluxe (RHD and auto) - for the wife, or so I told her!
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#27
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Just can't stay away

Icescreamer
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There are a few "young ones" out there. I am 38 now and have had Clara Belle (48 Deluxe Touring) for just over two years. When I got her she was parked in the back of a leaky damp warehouse and was being started with a pair of channel locks - yikes. I can not begin to describe how great it is to fix something, get it running and driving. Nothing makes me happier than taking her out for a drive with my wife, two sons (16 & 10 ) and dog - just got back from one.

Us young guys appreciate all the knowledge you share with us - thank you!

Posted on: 2020/4/12 17:39
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#28
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Tim Cole
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In the UK they are talking about having townspeople handle the harvesting of produce just like the 15th century. The plagues lasted over a century long period and the striking thing about this new disease is that, with all of the medical technology, the recovery rate is no better than during the 1918 flu. As well, places like Brazil have governments declaring the disease "the new hoax" which creates potential for mutations into something more virulent. Additionally, a lot of corporate managers are clinging to the notion of a "hoax" and no worse than a cold. 29 dead police officers in New York City seems a little worse than a sniffle. I find it amazing that it was the UAW that had to declare a strike to shut down Michigan.

Today's crossword puzzle clue: "Seven letter anagram for dumbass" Answer: manager.

All of this points to pressure on discretionary spending.

Posted on: 2020/4/13 6:14
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#29
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Brian Wilson
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Tim

Yes, what you say is true. I wonder how many of the inhabitants of today's UK towns are actually capable of doing a day's work in a field?

Discretionary spending has already taken a hit most places. A lot of people I know are consciously conserving cash. Maybe not a bad thing in the longer term.

Brian

Posted on: 2020/4/13 20:51
1941 120 Club Coupe (SOLD)
1956 Clipper Deluxe (RHD and auto) - for the wife, or so I told her!
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Re: Auction: '50 Super Eight, Stillwater, MN, June 6, 2020
#30
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Tim Cole
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We all are going to lose some weight in the near future. I've cut my caloric intake around 50%. Home exercise is probably not a good idea either because it wastes food. The more I look at this thing the more I'm inclined to think the virus survives as an aerosol - that is, it has sufficient coating to float without moisture - which accounts for the highly contagious nature.

For people working on their cars, doing such alone is probably the best practice although not the safest. Given hospitals are loaded with the dead and dying doing any activity involving injury risk is best avoided.

Fortunately, my background in mathematics allows me to consume my days working on applied differential equations. On the news they said government computer systems are broken down because they use old computer languages that not many people know how to program. Well, I did main frame computing for years, but they threw me out because I don't wear knee pads. When I look back on the talented people that were crapped on by management I get sick. So they they can suck it!

Personally, I suspect I have the stupid thing but my immune system has been slow to react to it. So it sits there making me suspicious. If I start detecting it and develop a fever the disease will respond by a massive attempt to escape by overwhelming my respiratory tract to get into the air and move to someone else. Think of it as a survival strategy. In rabies the virus survives by inducing an uncontrollable influence to bite and hold. Time will tell, but in the end this may become a chronic illness like Lyme disease only much more deadly.

Posted on: 2020/4/14 7:31
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