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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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Home away from home
 
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After 10,000 calories have been expended and someone connected with Aunt Mildred who bought a 120 convertible new and died in '42 while changing a tire it's time to use common sense and refer to the '35-'41 Packard Parts book.
Group 31.443 part# 313863 1087/1097 Envelope Assembly Top No details are given on material, my 1930 was canvas, same color as top. I ASSUMED that in '37 was still the same??
Posted on: 2017/2/28 13:31
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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I "ASSUMED " like Fred about the boot bag. My assumption was about the 1951-56 convertibles and that the were all the same deminsions, but they had different part numbers because they were made out of the top material used on the car.
Posted on: 2017/2/28 21:21
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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RE: the Howard Hughes/Jean Peters Caribbean... Yes, I took that photo and published it back in the 1970s when I wrote the article about the car's discovery for The Packard Cormorant magazine. I thought it was important for everyone to see this rare part that usually got tossed. The fellow who bought the car from the Hughes people was my friend, Stanley Zimmerman who was a member of PAC Earle C. Anthony Packard Club Region in the 1970s. This very Caribbean now resides in Stan's museum... the Automotive Driving Museum. But no-it is not driven with the other cars there.
RE: the Packard Parts Book for 35-41 term "envelope"... One of the oddities of the car biz is that different car companies (or technical writers) sometimes make up their own names for things that have standard terms. And thus defy or drift askew of industry standard terms that both OEMs and aftermarket people know and understand.For instance is you went to a trim shop anytime between say the 1930s and the 1970s and asked for an "envelope" for your convertible, the most likely response would have been... "business size or legal? Manilla or plain?" But in the overall sense of things, "top boot" or "dust boot" is a very commonly used standard trim shop and convertible industry term. It was used throughout North America for most of the golden years of convertibles. "Envelope" is whatever the guy who wrote that Packard parts book decided to call it. Just like some Ford tech writer decided "cigar lighter" was more appropriate than "cigarette lighter." Or a Packard tech writer somewhere decided to use "Cormorant" and somebody else along the way decided "Pelican" was more appropriate... and since the only standard would likely have been "bird," that particular controversy will continue on ad infinitum ...after all of us are long gone. Anyway, many of North American trimmer's terms were attempted to be defined by the godfather of that industry, my old friend Nat Danas. Many decades ago, Nat wrote the Auto Trimmer's Handbook (yesss, I still have mine) and did his best to keep definitions straight in his automotive industry periodical, Auto Trim News-which was once the bible of the business. As for a boot storage bag of the late 1930s being like the one used for 1955-56. That's a bit of a stretch since the parameters of the top differed considerably. But I will say that somewhere back in the recesses of my wretched salvaged Packard components tucked away is a top boot back from the early 1950s and one from the 1940s. These (the ones I saved out of old desert cars) were not made of vinyl, but rather of canvas. They appeared original and are the only ones I have ever seen. Saved them back in the 1970s. And before we end up back on this 3rd aspect... yes, I know "boot" is the term much of the world (particularly Europe) uses to describe what is known as a "trunk" in North America. There was a lively discussion about this terminology of boot vs. tonneau and boot vs. boot in an issue of the Packard Club's Cormorant News Bulletin several issues back. Now... see what ya started? LOL.
Posted on: 2017/3/1 0:23
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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Careful Leon or I might give you the boot in addition to the seats. (inside joke) Nat was a good friend of mine, the industry lost a gem.
Posted on: 2017/3/1 5:56
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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Hehehehehehehe... okay... touche!
And figured you knew Nat Danas. A very kind soul and knowledgeable man beyond words. He knew the automotive trim biz backwards and forwards. We corresponded for many years and of course I was a subscriber to his magazine. We used to have great times over dinner in Las Vegas at the SEMA shows over the years. Guys like that only turn up once or twice in a lifetime. Yes, the industry lost a gem and he will never be replaced. Thanks for the memories.
Posted on: 2017/3/1 9:57
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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55-56 parts book
31.0529 dust boot bag Since the 24th thru 56th series used virtually the same top well, my ASSUMPTION is still that the dust boot bag is the same dimensions but used the top material for that series. I looked for the blueprints, but I have had no luck, YET!
Posted on: 2017/3/1 12:05
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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Quote:
Yes, this is quite a natural, logical conclusion for the 1951-56 top well opening. And, as you point out, the fabrics of the boots during this period varied, largely following the soft top fabric. Of course there were other changes as well. Bracing, padding, seams, and above all, rear seat back interface. Of all these, the 1956 boot would have been most different with the completely new rear seat backrest design and thus new attachment. Stack height (measurement of how flat the top folded into the body) varied as well over these years. But again, the original question was about a junior convertible top boot bag from the 1930s which is a whole different animal in almost every regard: length, width, depth and more. As for blueprints, I never owned any of those. But I sure had a lot of patterns for tops and top boots, including all of the Caribbeans. I gave all of the patterns I had to George Westmoreland who was man in charge of Acme Auto Headlining Company in Long Beach, California back then (1970s). I also know that I gave George a few top patterns and they had many more up in the racks and rafters at Acme back then. Of course the entire regime changed there and I have no idea what ever happened to all those old patterns... but there were a LOT of them for Packard. Another company in SoCal that had Packard convertible patterns (including for top boots) was Robbins Auto Top Company (in those days in Santa Monica and now out near Ventura). But again the old regimes that were there back then are long gone. On the eastern end of the country back then was Electron Top Company and they also had a lot of patterns. All these companies were more on the level of wholesale-distributors (with the exception of Robbins who also had a retail trim shop back in the day -they closed this when they moved from Santa Monica). So normally these were not operations that dealt with the public. When it comes to patterns for the 1930s for convertible tops, top boots, boot bags, etc... this was already a disappearing entity by the 1970s. There were two companies in downtown Los Angeles still operating in the 70s. One was just a couple of blocks from the old Earle C. Anthony Packard dealership on Hope Street. These two companies not only had some 1930s patterns, but they were the sources of the most ancient automotive fabrics at that time on the West Coast. The names of these companies were Boething & Francis.... and Lindsay & Hall. No idea if either of them still exist, but they were once treasure troves of such stuff.
Posted on: 2017/3/4 13:35
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Re: Tonneau Cover bag
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Forum Ambassador
 
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....back then was Electron Top Company and they also had a lot of patterns.
Electron is still is business with patterns for most Packard convertibles. E-Z On Auto Tops down in Georgia is another source with most all Packard patterns. I've bought tops from both of these makers thru Bill Hirsch who represents them. http://www.electrontop.com/ http://ezonauto.com/about-us/
Posted on: 2017/3/4 15:33
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