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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#11
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Dave Kenney
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The oil pressure relief spring should not have any washers under it but if the engine bearings have been failing for some time a previous owner may have put one or more washers under the spring. If there are washer(s) under the spring it would indicate someone in the past was having the same problem as you are. When I started looking into my '47 engine I found a washer under the spring. It was a common quick fix.
I would recommend installing another oil pressure gauge into the oil pressure switch and see if your dash gauge is accurate.

Posted on: 2009/6/29 7:57
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#12
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JD in KC
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If the engine is quiet when cold, but starts to 'clack' when warmed up, I'd suspect a worn hydraulic lifter. If you are seeing a lot of oil flow from one lifter while the engine runs, that's probably the lifter with a problem. The oil thins as it warms up and then starts to bypass the worn piston in the hydraulic lifter causing the lifter to 'collapse'. Here's a photo of my 356 with an obvious worn hydraulic lifter (the engine is running).

Attach file:



jpg  (38.34 KB)
188_4a48c77e842aa.jpg 800X600 px

Posted on: 2009/6/29 8:54
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#13
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Owen_Dyneto
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JD, I'd agree with you if the correspondent hadn't initially said his maximum hot idling oil pressure is 20 psi and it doesn't increase with engine speed. While he may well have a leaking hydraulic lifter, it seems that's not the root cause of his problem.

Posted on: 2009/6/29 9:20
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#14
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JD in KC
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Right. But the comment about only 1 'journal' pushing oil sounds very suspicious, since none of the lifters should show copious oil flow. If low oil pressure is ultimately ruled out, this would be my next suspect.

Posted on: 2009/6/29 9:39
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#15
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JFH
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Thanks everyone for all your input.
The lifters are collapsed, a knowlegable mechanic friend stopped by to take a look and listen. I should have also mentioned the amount of blue smoke it pushes after the engine warms up. I guess it was wishful thinking on my part to have an old motor (the odometer states 52,365 miles) that was not running for almost 25 years to be perfect!
OK...so now the question is, what should I expect to pay for a rebuild kit? I know this is a wide open question at this point so I will tear it down first and see how everything looks.
Any thoughts on your experiences and suppliers would be greatly appreciated.

Posted on: 2009/6/29 16:34
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#16
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JD in KC
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Just a suggestion... give Kanter Auto Products a call and ask them to send you their latest catalog (or visit their website). They are not the only vendor that can supply the overhaul parts you may need but the catalog will give you a very good idea of current pricing either by part or complete overhaul kit. You can then compare with Max Merritt, Terrell Machine, etc.

On a positive note... the hydraulic lifters are currently being reproduced and are considerably less expensive than they were just a few years ago.

If you haven't already done it, be sure to download the Parts List, Owners Manual, Shop Manual, and other documentation for your model Packard. There is a wealth of knowledge to be gained just by reading through the information available free here on PackardInfo.com.

I have used Kanter, Max Merritt, Bill Hirsch, and Terrell Machine with good results from all of them. Don't forget the good ol' Parts Stores like NAPA for your more generic parts, canister oil filters, spark plugs, rubber hoses, brake lines, oil lines, radiator caps, odd shaped batteries, etc.

Posted on: 2009/6/29 22:26
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#17
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JFH
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JD in KC, thanks for the rebuild kit info. I do have a question with regard to the lifters. I understand that if a lifter is bad you will see quite a bit of oil from the oil passage hole (as the picture you posted indicates). Thats whats confusing about my engine. After its warmed up the lifters start to "clack" but there is only one oil passage hole that pushes oil (and not a huge flow by any means?) I can visually see that all the lifters are getting oil....yet they still make noise?
Could it be possible that this motor just needs to be run after sitting so long and over time this issue will work itself out?
I'm assuming the "blue smoke" and "clacking" are two seperate issues?

Posted on: 2009/6/30 5:21
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#18
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Dave Kenney
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If the car is driveable I would drive it about 500 miles and see what happens. Sometimes engines that have sat for a long time develop sticking rings and lifters that free up when the engine is run for a few miles. It's a long shot and it probably will never run like new unless rebuilt but it will probably run a whole lot better. Just take it easy !

Posted on: 2009/6/30 8:22
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#19
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Owen_Dyneto
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Driving it a bit may have a positive influence on the smoking problem and might quiet down one or more lifters, but almost certainly will have no affect on the oil pressure. With pressure that low, I'd certainly avoid anything but modest speeds, and keep an ear out for a rod rap in which case I'd immediately shut it down.

Am I mistaken or did we not hear back on the results of adding a shim to the oil pump relieve valve?

Posted on: 2009/6/30 8:42
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Re: Oil Pressure and...
#20
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JD in KC
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The oil in the photo is coming from the top of the hydraulic lifter exactly where the arrow is pointing. The oil doesn't gush, just a slow flow. With one bad hydraulic lifter, my engine made a loud clacking noise, but it was a rhythmic clack-clack-clack. If all your lifters start to clatter when the engine warms up, then you need to continue to pursue the low oil pressure problem. Once all the hydraulic lifters stay 'pumped up' you can see if you have any individual lifters that are badly worn. It is also possible for hydraulic lifters to malfunction due to debris in the lifter causing the valve check ball to stick but that doesn't sound like a factor based on the symptoms you describe.

I would do as Owen suggests and check that oil pump.

Generally speaking, blue smoke indicates oil leaking into the cylinders. This is most commonly caused by sticking or worn piston rings.

I would be very hesitant to drive the car if it sounds like a threshing machine.

Posted on: 2009/6/30 9:31
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