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Leeedy, I was fortunate at the Detroit PAC National to be on the tour bus of Detroit with you as our tour guide. You certainly did an EXCELLENT job of painting for us what life and times were like in those areas in your younger years. Hope you don't object to the photograph.

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And you don't look a day older than the earlier picture in the Hughes/Peters Caribbean in Beverly Hills!

Given the many other pictures of Packards on display at or about that spot in front of the EGB factory, it's a graphic contrast to things in the 1950s. Unlike Leeeedy, time has taken its toll.

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Owen... thanks for the very kind words. I can tell you that the whole tour was put together at the very last minute and everything I said came directly out of my memories of Detroit. We were originally supposed to have a different destination and guide. But both of those were cancelled at the very last minute... like that very morning! So when Roger asked me, of course, I was happy to volunteer my services.

I picked all of the places we visited, including downtown Detroit, Cobo Hall, Belle Isle and the Packard Plant. It was my hope to actually follow the route I wrote about in the special Packard Plant issue of The Packard Cormorant magazine a few years ago. So it was very gratifying to see the positive response from those on the buses.

Our first stop at Scott Fountain on Belle Isle should be one that every Packard fan ought to make at least once in their life. If you look at many of the old factory shots of Packards taken outdoors, there were photographed right here or in close proximity to this spot. Turning one direction is the skyline of the Motor City... and the other is the beautiful fountain.

In the old days, this beautiful marble fountain flowed and put an incredible mist and soothing energy in the air. At night it had special lighting that made the waters appear to magically change colors. These are the kinds of things that people today would never know unless someone told them. You could look at the dry marble structure today all day and never know what a magical place it once was.

Again, thank you for the kind words.

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Hahahahaha. Welll, those are more kind words. If only they were true. Sometimes I think back to the days when my father and I would drive past the Packard Plant and I would beg him to slow down at night so I could guess the shapes of the new bodies traveling across the bridge behind the frosted glass. Or the times when we would slow down and gaze at the rows of sparkling new Packards in the lot at EGB and Mt. Elliot. We really loved those cars and the company.

So to look at the plant (and Detroit) today is an emotional experience for me. Was it really that long ago? My mind often says no... but the face I see in the mirror when I shave unfortunately says... yes. It was a very, very long time ago.

Thanks again for the kind words and thoughts. It is an honor to share Packard memories and the love of a great company and automobile that unfortunately is no more... except with us...

I don't know how this will turn out on this forum, but here's the local TV news' muckraker reporter's take on the collapse into the street last fall.

At about the 56 second mark, right after the reporter talks to the people with the shopping carts, the camera pulls back to reveal that the roof of the bridge over EGB has collapsed, and revealing the 4 remaning floors of what, If I have it placed correctly, was a 5 floor building.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/video?clipId=9414711&autostart=true

Drove past the Willow Run bomber/Kaiser/Hydramatic plant today. the office buildings in front look OK, but the demo of the plant itself is well along.

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Hello, Yes. It you look at the photo in my posting on page 6 of this posting you will see that the Packard Plant at the very corner of EGB and Concord had an extension on top that made it 5 stories tall (actually 5.5 stories). This very last section once had a massive skylight with a glass roof.

And no... the TV reporter isn't going to find anyone who is going to take responsibility for the chunk of the building out in the street-and what ought to be an embarrassment of the fact that things have degenerated this far.

Just like no one is going to take the responsibility for answering the question of WHO is buying all of these stolen materials and WHY are they not being held responsible? Nobody in charge wants to know. AND... just like in the dope business... funds are changing hands, so? The ones who can...won't. They're all too busy with their jobs and business cards and offices and important titles ("executive director of the blah-blah-blah" etc.)... and meanwhile the beat (or the crumbling) goes on. I know... it's getting better... they built a new stadium... (hmmmm... by the way... what ever happened to Briggs/Tiger stadium? OR-dare I say it? The Silverdome???? Seen THAT lately???

And before someone attempts damage control over the Silverdome (while Detroit's management breathes a sigh of relief and points a finger north.).. I already know that the Silverdome is outside of Detroit city limits. Uh... but then that didn't save it from the same cancer, did it?

Uh-ohhhhhhh... I think I hear the sound of wind and crickets...

<i>by the way... what ever happened to Briggs/Tiger stadium?</i>

After sitting abandoned for about 10 years, Tiger Stadium was finally torn down. From time to time, people propose redevelopment plans for the site.

35 year old Joe Louis Arena has been declared obsolete, not enough luxury suites. A new arena and entertainment district has been proposed on Woodward, just north of I-75.

What happens to the Joe? To be torn down presumably. River front location quite valuable. Cobo Arena sat unused for years, before being rennovated into additional convention space as Cobo Hall has needed expansion for years.

re Belle Isle, the city has been too broke to properly maintain it for years. To improve the island's facilities, and relieve the city of the operating cost, the state has leased the island and added it to the state park system. Of course, the prospect of having to buy a state park pass to drive onto the island, access by foot or bicycle is free, had some screaming like their first born was being taken.

My best memories of Belle Isle are watching the hydroplane races from there in the 60s.

A new Belle Isle era begins under control of Michigan DNR, state police

The state is leasing Belle Isle for 30 years, a deal designed to save the city $4 million to $6 million annually.

What is now Michigan's 102nd state park will undergo numerous improvements -- as much as $20 million worth.

http://www.freep.com/article/20140211/NEWS/302110030/Belle-Isle-DNR-102-State-Park

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Hello... yesssss, already know about Briggs/Tiger stadium's fate... and even latest developments on Belle Isle.

However, the point here is that Detroit and the area typically lets things go to seed... then after many years of inaction and ruin... the best decision that can ever seem to be made is "...Hey! How about let's tear it all down!" Sadly, this happens over...and over...and over...and over...and (as evidenced in the Pontiac Silverdome and Detroit Joe Louis Arena. Neither of these facilities is very old, yet look what's happened to them?). And people are all shocked about the Packard plant?

And yes, I also enjoyed watching Gold Cup hydroplane races from Belle Isle, but I liked watching the races even better from either the pits at the foot of Burns Avenue where my grandfather kept his boat (and where my cousin worked on unlimiteds) OR from the Roostertail night club!

Fortunately I do not live in Detroit, but only a mile or two outside of it. In a little enclave that somehow is hanging onto to a level of decency.

I hear about the city trying to give real estate away, and how once snotty neighborhoods are now being foreclosed like crazy.

I flatly wouldn't take any of that stuff because the city and state government are so crooked it is a rotten investment.

Finally bought the Ward book and added it's information to what I already knew.

In July of 53:

-Kaiser at Willow Run was obviously cooked. The Air Force canceled it's contracts with Kaiser in late June, auto sales had crashed, the Willys plant in Toledo, acquired in April, rendered Willow Run redundant, and the Willow Run autoworkers were on strike.

-Ray Powers, head of manufacturing, started at Packard on July 1, 53. Powers had come from Ford. In the 50s, Ford was building state of the art auto plants at a rapid rate: Wayne stamping and assembly opened in 52, Wixom and Michigan Truck opened in 57, so he was up to speed in the latest, most efficient, manufacturing technology.

-Rumors of the Briggs sale were on the street in "midsummer 53" according to Ward.

Nance had everything to make a move on Willow Run, opportunity to acquire a plant for far less that the cost to build new, the knowledge to organize a new plant, and the recognition that he would soon be in urgent need of a body plant. He lacked one thing: money.

Kaiser would probably have considered an offer to lease the plant, as Hydramatic had initially leased it. Scaling from what Packard paid for Conner, with Willow Run being more than 4 times as large, the lease would have been $3-4M/yr

Packard CFO Grant estimated the savings from having both stamping and assembly under one roof would save Packard $12M/yr, based on producing 80,000 cars/yr. Or $1.3M based on 30,000/yr.

Taking over Conner from Briggs and continuing assembly at EGB would save $8M/yr for an 80,000 production rate.

So the cost of leasing Willow Run would make running costs of consolidation there a wash vs buying Conner and continuing assembly at EGB, and trail the $12M/yr savings of consolidation at Conner, at 80,000 cars/yr. At the production rate of 54, Packard would have been worse off than if they stayed at EGB, due to the lease cost.

But Packard didn't have the money to buy Conner either. Nance could only obtain a loan commitment for $7.5M, a million short of what Chrysler wanted, so they ended up leasing for slightly under $800K/yr, consolidating at Conner to maximize savings, and we know how that worked out.

To make the numbers work, Packard would need to buy Willow Run to eliminate the fixed cost of the lease payments. To raise the money, Utica would have to go, and leave powertrain production at EGB.

A quirk of the J-47 contracts was that the contractors had to provide their own facilities, though the government provided the equipment. Studebaker also had a J-47 contract, but played it wisely, leasing a plant in Chicago and using the South Bend Chippewa Ave plant it already owned, so when their contract was canceled a the end of 53, they were not out a large amount of capital. Packard had built Utica, and bought a plant on Mt Elliott to make forgings, for, accounts vary, $15-$17M. Nance was uneasy about defense contracts, recognizing the procurement decisions were political, but Hugh Ferry had made the commitments before Nance came on the scene.

How much would Willow Run have cost? Hydramatic bought the plant for $26M, "free and clear" meaning after Kaiser had, at it's expense, removed all it's equipment. Some of that equipment was moved to Toledo, eventually to make it's way to Argentina when the IKA deal was closed a year later, the rest went to scrap. Chrysler paid $35M for Briggs, as a going concern, with 8 equipped plants. Chrysler no doubt also assumed Briggs' liabilities. I would expect Packard could have bought Willow Run, with all the equipment: presses, body shop, paint shop, assembly lines, in place, for $30M

Curtiss-Wright might have been induced to buy Utica in 53. Hurley had turned CW around and was making a tidy profit in 53. According to Ward, by 56 C-W needed more factory space and was on the prowl for more defense contracts. While Packard's J-47 contract had been cut to 250 engines/month in early 53, it was not officially cut to the pilot line until the end of September. It might be interesting to speculate if the contract would have been cut at all if the contractor was anyone other than an automaker not named GM. So what would C-W have paid for Utica, Mt Elliott and assumption of the J-47 contract? $20M? In 56, C-W paid $25M for Utica and Chippewa Ave and another $10M for the defense contracts they had in hand, but the price paid was heavily influenced by additional defense contracts promised for their help in bailing out S-P.

To fill the shortfall between what C-W, or anyone else, would pay for Utica, Nance would have to take the $7.5M loan that was offered for Conner. Still short. McFarland would have a cow, but, if Packard stopped development of the Ultramatic and outsourced, it would have saved $4.5M in tooling costs for the Twin-Ultramatic.

Then move into Willow Run in phases: first moving the trim and assembly operations from EGB as soon as Kaiser vacated, late 53/early54. Then move the jigs for the senior bodies to W-R, aggressively recruit experienced former Kaiser body and paint people to assemble stampings shipped from Conner. When the senior bodies are being produced with acceptable quality at an acceptable rate, do the same with the Clipper bodies. Then move the dies to W-R and reactivate the stamping plant when the dies are replaced or modified for the 55 models. This is similar to the plan Nance had in mind to phase body production back into EGB.

Then take over Studebaker. Immediately close all South Bend operations. Consolidate production at W-R. Consolidate Studebaker parts distribution with Packard's. Consolidate dealer networks. Drop the Clipper name. Replace the top trim Clipper with the Executive. Replace the lower Clipper trims with Studebaker Commander and President: built on the Clipper platform with differentiated grill, taillights and dash, the low compression engine as provided to Nash and conventional spring suspension. Drop the Champion entirely. Approach George Romney about distributing the Rambler through Studebaker dealers to fill the low priced void created by abandonment of the Champion.