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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#11
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Rusty O\'Toole
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clipper47 wrote:
I am by no means an expert on Packards or any other car and I have limited experience with working on old cars. The one thing more than any other that strikes me about Packard and what makes them stand out from mediocre cars is the engineering, perhaps even over engineering of things which one cannot often see but which contribute to durability over time. On many occasions when taken something as simple as the clutch linkage apart I noticed that Packard used bearings and not simple bushings and made provision to lubricate these parts. The supports for the transmission and frame, the huge nine main bearings supporting that enormous crankshaft, the use of fine thread bolts ( I didn't break one when I restored my car!) are some of the things which set Packard apart from the "bean counter" companies including GM. The only other make of car that I am familiar with that even comes close is Mercedes-Benz.
Alas as H.L Mencken once said;
"Nobody ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public." but some perhaps overestimated that taste of the consumer by thinking that engineering and quality would sell cars and so Packard died.


If you examined a Chrysler from the same era I think you would find many parallels. They also featured fine design and fine quality. I am thinking in particular of a 1951 Hemi V8 New Yorker I used to own. Like the Packard it was put together with fine thread studs and nuts, not coarse thread bolts. The castings were fine grained. As Tom McCahill stated, if you examine a Chrysler piece by piece, every part looks like it costs more money than the corresponding part on competitive makes. Packard and Chrysler even bought their bodies from the same supplier.

I am familiar with Mercedes cars of the fifties and sixties. They were even better built than the Packard and Chrysler. In fact in some ways I believe they went too far in making things unnecessarily elaborate and expensive but the quality was unquestionably there.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 19:28
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#12
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Rusty O\'Toole
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Not to knock Chevrolet but they do not even belong in this discussion. They were a cheap car and do not compare to a Packard. Especially in the twenties through the early fifties even the cheapest Packard was obviously a far more expensive, comfortable, and luxurious car. It would outperform the Chevrolet in every way and outlast it at least 2 or 3 to 1.

I must emphasize that this is not to knock the Chevy. It was a good car in its class but was never meant to compete with Packard.

In the late fifties Chevrolet was much improved, and at the time the low priced cars had come much closer to the high priced cars but of course, by this time Packard was dead.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 19:34
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#13
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Rusty O\'Toole
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Maurice Hendry was a fan of American luxury cars and thought well of Packard for their comfort luxury and smoothness. But for sheer grinding hard work under difficult conditions he would choose Cadillac. He was referring here to the models of the twenties and thirties. I'm not sure he was right but that was his opinion.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 19:38
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
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Gary Marshall
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Noticed that even the 1949 Cadillac had fins, and by 1959 reached record height , what made them do this?
The Lincoln Continental was a big car with a distinctive shape at the front, did this car have a good name?
The 327 engine of Packard 1948, did many other makes use the same engine ?
The Packard Super Eight really changed it's shape, it must have been so modern for it's time?
Lastly, are there any famous names of people who owned Packards?

Posted on: 2010/12/6 19:54
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#15
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Owen_Dyneto
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Gary, it sounds to me like you could really enjoy reading a history of the PMCC, perhaps you can get your hands on a copy of the Turnquist or Kimes-edited book. It would answer many of your questions and I'll bet you'd have a hard time putting it down once you started.

At least up until WW II, Packard was much favored by the rich and famous, the Hollywood set, heads of state, and foreign governments. MANY famous personalities owned Packards.

No car other than Packard used the Packard 327 engine, or any other Packard engine for that matter with the sole exceptions of the 56 Studebaker Golden Hawk which by that time was part of the corporate family.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 20:04
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#16
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HH56
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I believe some Nash and Hudson models used a 55 and maybe very early 56 Packard engine and trans did they not. Of course, if the stories are to be believed and things had happened as planned they would have been part of the corporate family.

O_D is right on about the history books. You probably would enjoy some. Check out the bookshelfpackardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/BookShelf/ and see if any might be in a library near you.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 20:18
Howard
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#17
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Howard, the 55 and early '56 Nash models used the Clipper-displacement Packard V8 engine and Twin Ultramatic transmission. I am not aware of any V-8 Nashes using any other trans if they came equipped with the Packard V-8. I drove a 55 Nash so equipped on a somewhat long trip, about an hour, it was terrific!

Posted on: 2010/12/6 20:56
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#18
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Gary Marshall
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Will check out books for sure, perhaps Santa will be kind to me.
Is the Turnquist book in the list of books on line here at Packard info ? Which visit Library for sure.
Are there any videos of Packard cars? Or Packard cars being restored?

So everyone is agreed Packard is number one for years 1948 to 1953. ? Perhaps Caddy second. I have seen the Desoto, on photos looks a lovely car, was it a good car?

Posted on: 2010/12/6 20:59
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#19
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Dave Kenney
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Quote:

Rusty O\'Toole wrote:
Quote:

.


If you examined a Chrysler from the same era I think you would find many parallels. They also featured fine design and fine quality. I am thinking in particular of a 1951 Hemi V8 New Yorker I used to own. Like the Packard it was put together with fine thread studs and nuts, not coarse thread bolts. The castings were fine grained. As Tom McCahill stated, if you examine a Chrysler piece by piece, every part looks like it costs more money than the corresponding part on competitive makes. Packard and Chrysler even bought their bodies from the same supplier.

I am familiar with Mercedes cars of the fifties and sixties. They were even better built than the Packard and Chrysler. In fact in some ways I believe they went too far in making things unnecessarily elaborate and expensive but the quality was unquestionably there.


Rusty, I couldn't agree with you more. MY very first car was a 1952 Chrysler Windsor and it oozed quality and solidity much like my present Clipper. I also owned 3 Mercedes cars the last ebing a 450SL and they were all very solidly built and reliable cars.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 21:56
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Re: Packard versus the Rest
#20
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ScottG
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Bottom line: Strange isn't it that chevy, more often than not is used as a yard stick or standard for comparison to just about everything????


What's even more strange is that using Chevrolet as a yardstick by which to measure other automobiles hasn't been a valid exercise since they dropped the RWD Monte Carlo in '88 and the RWD Caprice in '96. Those were the last Chevrolets with a heritage dating back to the days when Chevy meant value and reliability. The dreck GM has put on the market sporting the bowtie since then is one of the main reasons that Generic Motors landed with a big, fat thud in bankruptcy.

Quote:
Noticed that even the 1949 Cadillac had fins, and by 1959 reached record height , what made them do this?


From what I've read, GM caught a drift of the soon to be released 1957 Chrysler Corp products and "got scared." Witness the GM fins jumping from the relatively mild '58's to the outlandish '59's.

Posted on: 2010/12/6 22:25
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