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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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BH
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More specifically, the confidential field trial for reworking the early design oil pump involved removing the cotter pins and relief valve retainer cup and brazing the cotter pin holes shut. Then, the relief valve bore was to be tapped with 9/16-24 thread, and a plug fabricated (from a bolt, IIRC) to hold the retainer cup in the same position as previous.

Additionally, a couple of V scores were to be cut, lengthwise, in the original relief valve - half its length and 1/4" apart - to allow trapped oil to move, but prevent entrance of air.

Sorry, but no pix/drawings were provided.

Though this trial was very limited in duration and scope, this might explain the presence of a plug in some early pumps.

Posted on: 2013/9/27 21:11
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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I wonder IF the blue prints exists for the pump, and if it would give us some details.

Randy, of course it was sincere, I would like to see this car back up and running. Got to get the pit crew up and running too, so he can work on it!

Posted on: 2013/9/28 11:19
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Randy Berger
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I have Magic Mike from Minnesota aka 3M looking for the latest oil pump for me, but having no luck so far. If he can't get it by next week, I'll clean up the original one (V2) and put it back together.

Posted on: 2013/10/12 20:12
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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patgreen
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Please rethink the folly of using the original oil pump. No one has made it work reliably and efficiently, for what ever reasons.

The olds 442 solves the problems as far as I can see. You will still have wipers.

If you plan to drive extensively in rain, go electric; it's safer....

Posted on: 2013/10/12 20:59
When two men ride the same horse, one has to be in the back...
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Randy Berger
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Before you repeat everything you read, you should ascertain the truth of those statements. There are many V8 Packards running that have had only a bushing installed in the upper part of the pump to guide the shaft. My 400 is among them and I don't baby it. Still yet there are several V8s that I am aware of running with original pumps that are doing just fine.
You are also unaware of logistic problems I may have and the demands of my time and space.

Posted on: 2013/10/12 22:53
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Owen_Dyneto
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Patgreen, a full understanding of the issues some V8 owners have had with engine oiling problems is probably multifaceted and still somewhat elusive, and I'll freely admit that the Packard oil pump design wasn't in the top 10 of all time, but to automatically call it "folly" to not just to change it for the sake of change, just shows, IMO, that you have a lot more reading and learning to do about the subject.

On one side, there certainly are V8 Packards that have had oil pump problems and for them, perhaps the replacement with the Old/Melling pump is the simplist and best solution. But by far the VAST majority of V8 Packards still run original type oil pumps without problems, including many like mine with very high mileage and yet with superb oil pressure and no lifter noises. Of all the V8 Packard owners I am very familiar with, all run the original pump with no problems and some happily drive thousands of miles each year across the country to various events. It's this range of experiences, from significant issues to absolutely none, that makes it an interesting subject.

Posted on: 2013/10/13 9:09
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Randy Berger
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Mike D. is having a problem finding oil pump #3.

56T-20 mentions pump #2 which now has a threaded bolt in place of the cap and cotter pin, but nowhere is pump #3 described which is completely redesigned and I noted is part #6480508. This part # is not in section 5.1200 or subsequent listings, BUT it is in my Master Price List and sells for $15.00 dealer net, $25.00 list, or $18.75 trade net. This pump uses a shorter spring and piston than pump #1 or #2. The shorter spring and piston are listed as separate parts.
The parts book is revised July 1, 1956 where the price list is revised Sept 1, 1956.

Posted on: 2013/10/24 23:21
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Mr.Pushbutton
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Jumping on this bandwagon: I know of several '56 models running just fine on their original oil pumps. To say that the pump could not be made to run reliably is not an accurate statement IMO. Early 1955 engine? maybe so, but those can be retrofitted with '56 pumps.
Packards1 has some NOS gear sets for the V-8 oli pump, I would have no reservations about using those.

Posted on: 2013/10/25 8:21
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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BH
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Quote:
pump #3...which is completely redesigned and I noted is part #6480508. This part # is not in section 5.1200 or subsequent listings, BUT it is in my Master Price List and sells for $15.00 dealer net, $25.00 list, or $18.75 trade net.

That's because that P/N is for the oil pump assembly originally used in 56J Golden Hawk models (Gr. 116 in the Stude parts book), which has a flat bottom plate, rather than a separator plate and vacuum pump. I've no doubt this is what inspired the modification promoted by PI for so many years. Yet, Studebaker Service Letter No. 936 also notes the introduction of a revised, plugged pump in production.

However, the Studebaker parts book, like its Packard counterpart, does not provide a P/N for a complete late-design pump assembly. Perhaps that's because they did not want dealers throwing them on prior engines, en masse. Whether that was a matter of supply not being able to keep up with demand or other incompatible changes in the block, we may never know - short of an extensive audit of engineering drawings.

Menawhile, just what is the casting number of the oil pump body on this car?

Posted on: 2013/10/25 9:59
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Re: 56 Patrician bought off ebay
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Randy Berger
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The casting number on pump #1 and #2 is "440662". I still have the pump that originally came from my 400. It has the tube fix mentioned incidentally in 56T-20.

Posted on: 2013/10/25 14:31
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