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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#11
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JeromeSolberg
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When I read the spec it says "40 psi" for the oil pressure. So that seems right. I seem to remember seeing 35 psi somewhere else, but here it is in the book at 40 psi:

1951-54 Service Manual Specifications

What I saw on the gauge was a steady 40 psi, varying only slightly when I revved the engine or as the engine warmed up. You could see if I revved the engine the reading would rise slightly before settling down again.

Now tomorrow when I get the chance I will start the engine and let it run for a good 40 minutes and see if I can get the light to blink, perhaps by adjusting the idle down slightly.

It's possible that the idiot light is set a little high, since I have never tested it and have no idea how old it is. I didn't rebuild the oil pump internals but I did install a new relief valve, but it does seem to be working.

Will report back.

Thanks for your interest and advice.

JS

Posted on: 2021/10/15 0:00
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#12
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JeromeSolberg
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Update:

I ran the engine (idling) for more than 1 hour and 15 minutes.

After ~30 minutes I noticed the oil pressure (at idle) was dropping below 40.

By the end of 1 hour and 15 minutes the oil pressure at idle had dropped down to ~ 10 psi, though it rose quickly to 40 if I applied a bit of throttle. The little red light had yet to flicker. However, I ran out of time to find out at what oil pressure the light begins to flicker. Probably as was noted earlier b/t 5 and 10 psi.

Lifter began to slightly tick at about the same time as the oil pressure began to drop below 40, and the tick got louder as the oil pressure dropped.

May try again later for more data.

Posted on: 2021/10/15 16:04
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#13
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JeromeSolberg
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Well, since I had two extra lifters left over from rebuilding, I did the very best I could to determine which lifter was the loudest using an automotive stethoscope, which seemed to be Cylinder #5 intake or exhaust. So I replaced them both. That took about a day all told. I measured the clearance using the little gage I got from Pacific Northwest Packards, and it was between .040 and .060, so within spec of 0.030 to 0.070.

Now after another long drive it's seemingly no better than it was before. I listened again with my stethoscope and maybe it's another couple of lifters, maybe, and maybe a couple of other lifters farther away, it's very hard to tell. Maybe I replaced the wrong ones, or maybe I just didn't replace enough. It sounds like the ones I replace are "better", but they still maybe are clicking a little too, very hard to tell because I may be picking up noise from the lifters next door, maybe it's those I should have replaced.

I don't really know exactly what to do, order some more lifters? They are not cheap, and it's a lot of work to change them. Change the oil again and put in 20W50? I have Delo 15w40 in now, it seems not really better and perhaps worse than when I had the 10w30 in there.

I guess I'm just very frustrated right now. I don't know if there is any advice anyone can give me, but if there is I'm open to it. I cannot really figure out what I did wrong, sorry to vent.

Posted on: 2021/10/26 17:19
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#14
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Josef Lichtenberg
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did you change the valve springs too? Or only the lifers? I have used new today made valve srings. Some of them failed. ( broke in half) after a few miles. sounds similiar to ticking lifters.

Posted on: 2021/11/11 4:32
Packard Super Clipper 1947
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#15
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JeromeSolberg
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Thank you for the note. When I replaced 2 lifters I didn't see any broken valve springs, but I only took off one of the two valve covers.

I will be going back in soon, perhaps this weekend, hope to have a new report.

Posted on: 2021/11/11 17:06
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#16
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PackardDon
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Did you use the special gauge to adjust the valves with the new lifters? The adjustment requires machine shop work to grind the end of the valve stem or seat t get the proper gap, then when the hydraulic insert is put in place, it will work within the prescribed range.

Posted on: 2021/11/11 20:50
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#17
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JeromeSolberg
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Yes I have the special gauge, I got it from Pacific Northwest Packards (club project). I measured the clearance on all the valves, there were a few that were near 0.030, but all were in the range .030 to .070, which is spec. That was done cold.

But I'm going to measure them again. When I replaced the two lifters with the two spares the clearance was between .040 and .060.

But yes, good to check again. Thanks.

Posted on: 2021/11/11 21:19
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#18
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JeromeSolberg
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In the end, I sat with a stethoscope and put it on the valve stems themselves as they went up and down, as the engine was running. That was possible using the long stethoscope probe, you just rested the side of the end of the probe on the valves.

I found 2 "bad" ones and 3 "suspect" ones.

I put new ones in. Thank you Ross for testing the ones I had purchased, they tested out good, as did the two I had taken out previously, which were probably the wrong ones as I had only listened from the head with the valve covers on, which is very difficult as the sound travels everywhere.

I checked the clearance for the lifter plungers with the gage I obtained from Pacific Northwest Packards, everything was between 0.040 and 0.045 clearance, well within the spec of 0.030 to 0.070.

I cleaned all the lifter passages up real well also, and I installed a rebuilt oil pump I obtained from Kanter. I also installed an oil pressure gage in the passenger compartment - mechanical, using copper lines.

I took it on two long drives, each lasting over an hour, and in both cases the lifters were quiet, even as the engine/oil slowly heated up.

No noisy lifters anymore. At the end of the runs I had oil pressure at idle with the transmission in H of around 8 or 9 psi (rapidly going to 35 above idle), I think that is better than what I would get previously, which would sometimes cause the oil light to flicker - no flickering anymore.

So, crossing my fingers, seems like I have solved the lifter problem. Thanks everyone for your help and advice.

Posted on: 2/4 22:01
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#19
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HH56
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Glad everything finally seems to be cooperating but if the oil light does flicker again on occasion Packard did consider the flicker to be a normal occurrence.

Attach file:



jpg  oil.jpg (518.25 KB)
209_61fdeeba35970.jpg 1582X1056 px

Posted on: 2/4 22:27
Howard
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Re: Noisy Lifters even though they are new
#20
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JeromeSolberg
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Well, after getting the car warmed up really good after driving it for an extensive period (over 2 hours), the lifter tick is back, again after I warm it up really good. Got frustrated and changed the oil out to 20w50, that seemed to make things a bit better (the oil light doesn't flicker after full warm up, though I realize that's "by design" as pointed out in a previous post), but it still happens.

I'm so frustrated.

Posted on: 2/12 23:13
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