Packard Forum Index » Pre-War (1899-1942)

What kind of fuel filter do you have? Paper or modern probably no issue but if the original ceramic type I had an problem where the filter was partially clogged with varnish -- most likely from fuel periodically drying in the bowl during long sits between runs. Air would flow thru easily so pump would fill the bowl and filter would allow enough fuel to trickle past and run the engine at idle just fine. The issue came when needing enough flow to go faster than idle or a slow speed. The filter being clogged just would not allow enough fuel to pass to keep the carb full with the increased demand. The bowl would also get fairly empty then too and attributed that to perhaps todays more volatile fuel "boiling" from the manifold heat because it was moving fairly slow and allowing the gasses to accumulate in the bowl.

That's a good thought that reminded me that when I bought my 1939 Packard Six in the mid-'60s and drove/ferried it home to Bellevue, Washington from the Port Townsend area, we had a hard time even making it out of town to the ferry terminal. Although not even quite an antique yet at the time, it had been parked a long time so we (the owner's father and I - I never met the owner himself as he was away in the service) stopped at a small gas station with a good old-time mechanic who instantly diagnosed the problem to a screen that the Stromberg carburetor has at its inlet. Maybe grasping for straws here but it's something to check even if the carburetor has been rebuilt as sediment might have worked its way up to it. Just a few minutes' work and we were back on the road and he didn't even charge which, for a 16-year-old as I was, was fine and he refused the few dollars I had to offer!

EDIT: It had a 1940 110 engine, which I still have!

Using a modern Fram inline fuel filter Howard. Have changed it a couple of times too. Any ideas as to why the pressure but no fuel???

If the pump is not drawing air as you suspect the only other thing I can think of is the regulator is working like a needle valve and is restricting the flow along with the pressure. Is there an easy way to eliminate the regulator temporarily just to see if the flow is changed?

Maybe use something like a coffee can and run the pump X seconds with the regulator to see the level and then remove the regulator and run the same X seconds to see if the level fills to the same point in the can. If it does then the regulator is probably not an issue but if a significant difference maybe try a different type or brand regulator or see if the carb can handle the pressure without the regulator..

I wanted to answer Dave's question of 'Why do you have all this complexity of electric pump and pressure reducer as opposed to the simple, proven and reliable mechanical fuel pump?'
In diagnosing this problem initially a couple of years back, there were so many possibilities as to what the cause COULD be and I was busy trying to eliminate everything, it became a bit expensive and I thought if I could mount an electric pump and bypass the mechanical pump altogether, it would at least eliminate that as a culprit. Also, there was a buildup of braze on the pumping arm of the old mechanical pump and not knowing much about the car, I figured maybe the cam lobe that drove it was worn. I felt he electric option removed any 'unknowns' about all that from the equation.

To clarify, my current setup completely bypasses the mechanical pump and the pressure reg was added to keep the fuel pressure down a bit. (from the max 8 PSI the pump could put out)

And Howard, I have taken the line from the tank and completely bypassed the pressure regulator, and the fuel filter still empties out. Then when I unhook the line, there is this 'burst of air' and very little fuel. Yet if I then activate the pump with no back pressure, I get TONS of fuel?!?!?!?

Once I get this problem sussed and rectified I intend on returning to a factory mechanical fuel pump with the electric guy as backup. First I have to figure out why I am not getting fuel from the tank to the front of the car.

The next step is to remove the fuel line from the carb and activate the pump and see how the pump delivers over a set period of time as Howard suggests. Then I will pinch off the line with the pump running for a few seconds and release it and see if I get any air. That should be a good start in nailing this down.

Thanks again for all the help!!!! Chris

Are you sure you have checked the rubber gasket in you glass filter? If that is what you have.

I've never seen the glass filter housing stay full on any of my cars (my 1965 Cadillac and all my Packards have them) so perhaps you're chasing a symptom that doesn't exist! First thing is to check pressure from the pump at the carburetor regardless of which pump, then work back from there. Throwing parts and additional plumbing at it is never a good solution and makes the actual problem more difficult to locate.

However, what you said about the pump arm makes me wonder if it's the proper pump. Many look alike but the geometry of the arms can be quite different between makes and even between models of the same make..

As long as you intend to eventually reinstall a mechanical pump, why not do it now? Obtain and install the correct and rebuilt mechanical pump, connect to a temporary gas can with some gas line hose, and go for a drive. You can give the cam lobe a cursory check with just a flashlight. A rebuilt mechanical pump was perhaps (likely?) all you ever needed in the first place.

One more though and perhaps you've covered this before, I didn't want to go back and read the entire history. I had a problem like yours once where the car would stall from a lack of gasoline in the carburetor but after sitting for a few seconds it would start up and run until it happened again. It was caused by some idiot who used silicone gasket paste on the tank filler neck flange (a bolted flange in this case) and a gob of silicone snot oozed into the tank and floated around until it got sucked up against the pickup tube; as the engine stalled and the fuel pump stopped, it would fall away until the cycle repeated itself again and again.

Dave, re the mechanical pump, I will eventually get one, but right now, I am only interested in trying to deliver fuel from tank to carb and the electric pump should be able to do that. A rebuilt pump is around $300 CDN and is a couple of weeks away via Kanters or M.M., etc., so I am trying to work with what I have and at least get the thing so I can drive it on the highway and not have it quit.

The Carter WA-1 carb does not have a glass bowl - a few people are mentioning that; the only 'visual' I have on the fuel is a see-through inline gas filter and if it is running out of fuel then I definitely have a problem!!! I will get back to the car on Monday and perform some more tests and see if we can't come to a solution. I'll report my findings.

Thanks again for all the feedback.

OK, your choice on fuel pump. Good luck.

The glass bowls referred to were not part of the carburetor but old style factory accessory in-line gas filters, Carter or AC. It's quite common to see them not completely filled with gasoline, as Packard Don noted.