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SOME CLOSURE TO THE MONTE CARLO MATTER

At a CCCA meeting today I got some further information on the fate of 2 of the Monte Carlos from Ralph Marano. Many of you will recognize Ralph for his extensive collection of fine cars, including a gaggle or two of Darrins, 1 each of the 1934 LeBarons, and many of the postwar show cars including a Pan American, the Vignale, both Balboas, the Request, and I believe a Daytona.

Ralph's information is that one of the two 1952 Monte Carlos survives in a private collection in Georgia, and that the 22nd Series Monte Carlo was not crushed but cut up into scrap some years back.

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Agreed on the looks. Not much wonder these Monte Carlos disappeared pretty quickly.

Also agreed this is a really good thread.

Can't tell about closure yet, though.

I think Kimes uses the term "spares" because they are referring to TWO 1952 Mayfair hardtops that were to be converted by Henney:

"...with 1953 style bumpers, headlight rims, fender and body moldings, deck lid ornaments and grilles. The Monte Carlos had wire wheels, exterior spares..." (p. 554, Packard, a History of the Motorcar and the Company, General Edition, Beverly Rae Kimes, Ed., Automobile Quarterly pub. 1978)


Here's a little more info on the Kelsey-Hayes wheels from Kimes:

"Some production of Pan Americans was definitely planned--at least by Henney. On March 13th (1952) Preston Boyd wrote that he had mentioned to Packard 'the necessity of having some sort of a tentative price . . . Of course, one of the chief problems is to know how many [Packard] wants to run or commit itself for, which will be a determining factor . . . if it is to be offered with wire wheels it will mean complete tooling for production of these, which will be rather costly.' (The wheels eventually selected were bought from Kelsey-Hayes, cutting costs considerably.)" [Ibid.] Emphasis added.

So, did the few Pan Americans get out on the roads with K-H wire wheels? Well, there's a picture of one, prominently showing a front wheel, on page 555 of Kimes. I'm no expert, but I know people here that are and have the Kimes book. I'll leave it up to you to identify the wheel. It's beyond me.

One of the BEST bits of closure I can think of is the CARIBBEAN, which was, after all this building and testing (exciting as it is) of project cars, the ultimate production car that resulted and tore up the roads for a few glorious years.

Good thing I said SOME closure, I guess I'm due for a re-read of the Kimes book and thanks for the information about the wheels. Next time I see Ralph Marano I'll take a better look at the wheels on his Pan American and also see if he remembers seeing the maker's name on them.

I've seen both a just-prewar and a just-post-war B&S Cadillac convertible coupe and I believe there were at least 2 B&S Packards at the 1999 Centennial. B&S was in Pasadena, CA and set up by former employees of the Walter Murphy Company. Their cars are generally pretty flamboyant as you would expect for a firm whose primary clientele was the Hollywood crowd.

Two often-seen pictures of their work on Packards can be seen on pg 189 of Hugo Pfau's The Coachbuilt Packard; these two a 1941 convertible sedan and a 1940 Enclosed Drive limousine.

In this thread we had stuck to the postwar show cars and custom creations that Packard produced; if we want to branch out into the work of the custom coachbuilders, I suggest we start a new thread.

Just found a link to a webpage featuring Creative Industries, which collaborated with Packard on a few of our favorite postwar concepts:

http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/c/creative/creative.htm

The pix may be familiar to some, but the text offers a bit of additional insight on how two of the four original 1954 Panthers came to be refitted with 1955 taillights - often misconstrued by enthusiasts as 1955 Panther models.

Brian, great link and story about a little-known company But the writer wasn't as accurate as he should have been. Designed by Dick Teague, the Request was built using a modified Patrician with a new front end treatment utilizing a classic-era Packard-style grill separated by two massive front bumpers.
We all know the Request was built using a 400 hardtop.

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I'm a bit suprised that some are just learing about www.coachbuilt.com, it's been around for quite some time and is a well-known resource, usually pretty accurate but as Randy points out, not always.

Wonder how the Request would look with the 56 eyebrows.

Does anyone know if the person that owns the car now fixed the poor fit on L side hood when it was restored a few years back or did it get restored? The car was shown at the PAC national in Oakland many years ago, and the person (don't know if it was current owner) that owned/showed it then said it was going to be restored and that fit was going to be worked on. I think he said it had been wrecked and the bronze?? bumper had been cracked & had a poor repair.

The gentleman from the West Coast who owned it at the time of the PAC Centennial in 1999 subsequently sold the car to a collector in New Jersey where it is undergoing a full restoration. It was in rather deteriorated condition despite a partial restoration about 15-20(?) years ago.

Thanks for update. The meet where I saw it had to have been right after the partial restoration-late 80's. Remember car sounded terrible & he had trouble getting it out of park. Also mentioned the cast bumper & one-off lack of parts as extremely hard to work on and cost a fortune but he was going to fix the car.

Edit: IIRC, something else he mentioned. Said the bumpers and grill were incredibly heavy and the suspension would not keep front end up so it was blocked. Anyone know the car well enough to know if that's a correct statement?