Packard Forum Index » Post-War (1946-54)

I need some help if anyone can help me. I bought a 1953 Packard limo last year from a guy who got it from a guy who got it from an estate blah blah blah..., anyways, the title I got with the car said 1953 packard limo, but the vin on the title did not match the vin on the car. The vin that is on the driver side door opening is 5492-2149, but that means it is a 1954 I think. I paid a lot of money for this car, and of course the guy I got from has long disappeared since then. I am ready to start restoring this car, but I need to know if this is a paperwork nightmare or if I should just swallow my losses and move on. I primarily work on 1970-1981 F Body cars, so the Packards are foreign to me. If anyone can help I would greatly appreciate it.

Welcome to the forums! Alas, it looks like you may have been "had" - at least by virtue of the serial number tag.

If you check the site's handy Model Info pages, you'll find that 1953 is the 26th Series for Packard and (after changing Series numbering to reflect calendar year) 1954 is the 54th Series. Series number is important as it was used for the first two digits of the vehicle serial number; the next two digits relect the specific model.

5492 is the tag for a Clipper Deluxe Touring Sedan, which is more of an entry-level Clipper.

Packard limousine models were conversions done by an outside firm - Henney. Model 50 for the Corporate edition and 51 for the Executive version. A 1953 Packard limo would have a serial number that starts with either 2650 or 2651. I don't know enough of about these cars to distinguish them any better.

It might be that you have a genuine limo, but only need to get the serial number issue resolved. What are the first four digits of the serial number as shown on the title you have for the car? Is there a motor serial number listed on the title? Got any pix of the car?

A little more information may help others to provide additional insights.

What is the Body-Number (found on the fire wall plate), and also the Engine serial number. Both of these can be used to narrow down what exact model you have. My car is 5492-xxxx (Clipper Deluxe Touring Sedan). It is possible someone replaced the door jam plate. The body-number plate, and the engine number should help to narrow that down.

Also check the outside of glovebox for a trim/paint code sticker.

Just commenting on the advice you've already gotten, a 1953 long-wheelbase VN would begin with 2650 for a limousine (divider window) or 2651 for an executive sedan (no divider window). Both are on the 149 inch wheelbase. The correct engine numbers for these chassis should be between L-60001 and L-607829. If the car has the 149 inch wheelbase, it can't be a Clipper model as suggested by your VN plate, but perhaps it's a 54; the body numbers would be 5450 and 5451 and the engine number range is M-600001 to M-605618. There may also be a body number tag on the cowl near the heater which would either be the Briggs sequence number (all except the lwb cars) or the Henney # (lwb cars) which should also clarify things. The large embossed number on the cowl is the "thief-proof" number and could be used to differentiate a 53 from a 54, but not much more as there is no remaining record of these, just members like myself who have been collecting them for decades and can sometimes decode them.

I suppose changing the VN tag on the door jam sometimes happens but it's generally illegal to tamper with a VN and when it's done with valuable collector cars its often the sign of a bogus car.

I guess I should have said (more properly) that the second two digits Of the serial number reflect the body style. Together with the Series number, those four digits make up the model number.

Our webmaster, BigKev, wisely chose to provide a search by model number in the "Model Info" section. Thus, you can also browse all models of a given Series or model year. (Keep in mind that some Series spanned more than one year, but some model years included more than one series.) Also, while pages for PreWar models are a work-in-progress, postwar Packards are complete through 1956 (56th Series), and I'm working on 1957 and 1958 for the sake of closure.

Model information is neatly summarized in that section, but know also that model/serial number info is disclosed in factory parts books, which have been widely available as reprints for decades - through major Packard parts vendors as well as clubs.

That said, someone would have to be awfully naive to think they could put a Clipper serial number plate on a limo and get away with it.

However, if the estate included multiple Packards in various stages of repair, there might have been some mix-up in getting them ready for sale. I've seen a lot of damage done to old cars in trying to make them "presentable" for an estate auction; I won't even bid on most of them anymore if I see evidence of any shortcuts.

If you were ripped off, you clearly have some grounds for legal action - civil and criminal. Keep us posted.

The # stamped on the firewall is C35I90. But the # stamped on the motor is L3058695, which is a clipper. I will put up some pictures later, but this is a limo, just pretty well bastardized. There was a # stamped by where the motor meets the tranny #433528 and on the bottom of the block 1 22 53. There was also 12852 emboseed on the front of the motor. I'm hoping that # on the firewall will help a little, because that obviously can't be tampered with. I really appreciate everyones help so far.

Are you sure this body is a limo? Please measure wheelbase and let us know. Your "thief-proof" number dates the body to 1953; your engine# (with one too many digits) is a 1953 Clipper DeLuxe and your VN tag is for a 1954 Clipper DeLuxe. The other numbers you mention (433528, 1 22 53 and 12 8 52) are casting numbers and dates which are consistent with 1953 production. However, none of these are consistent with a long wheelbase (149 inch) limo. Appears that you've got a mongrel, of which, unfortunately, there are far too many these days, resulting from folks who just can't resist buggering a car. How about a few pictures?

Starting to sound like someone was into making stretch limos long before it became the ride of choice for the younger set.

Ok, I took some pictures of the car. The wheel distance is about 149 inches form the wheel centers. I got ahold of the guy I got it from and he is in the process of a law suit against the guy he got it from. He was able to get me the vin from the title he gave me. It is 52664001. It says 1953 Packard L40 limo. I need to know if a vin would be stamped anywhere else on the body. If we take this guy to court, I have to be able to prove it is not what the title says it is. Also, the vin plate on the inside of the door does not look normal. The packard VIN plates were very ornate, and this one is very government issue looking. When my batteries charge back up I will get you all a picture of it. But any help on finding a vin stamped somewhere else would be very helpful.

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One more issue Heather is the the front grilles on that car is from a 51 or 52.

53 and 54 grilles did not ahve the "bullseye" parking lights.

To answer your question, there is really no other place the VIN is marked on the body or fame. When you say the VIN looks governmental, it may just very well be. I know in California if the original VIN plate(or serial number plate in the case of a Packard) is missing, then the state will issue you a new one with a VIN of their choosing (After a CHP inspection). This is usually a sticker (sometime a plate) the is mounted to the engine bay usually near the top radiator support or close by.

My Serial number plate is missing, and from the last registration slip dated 1986, it was registered using the engine serial number as the VIN.

Sometimes it is easier to just file for a missing title then trying to get an incorrect one fixed. Lots old cars are bought and sold on just a bill of sale only.

If you know anyone in law enforcement, I would encoruage you to have them run the vin number, title vin number, body-plate number, and engine number through the computer just to make sure nothing has been reported stolen before you put and money into that car.

That was the first thing I did since the serial number plate was missing. I had them run the engine serial, and also the Body Plate number. It was no longer listed in the computer due to the fact it was last registerd 20+ years ago. Also they showed that no vehicle with those numbers was reported stolen.

Better safe than sorry.