Packard Forum Index » V-8 (1955-56)

Greetings Packard V8rs,

Thought I would give an update on the kit production status.

First, we owe Eric credit for researching and proving the idea, Craig credit for putting it into production and several others for help with testing and feedback.

Having said this, the adapter Craig was having made was reverse-engineered and produced one-at-a-time on a manual mill. It worked, but was expensive to make and accuracy was variable.

When Craig turned over production to me, he mentioned some users had minor fitment issues. Since, as Craig will attest, there isn't a lot of profit in making and selling the kits; there isn't enough money to suffer any hassles. I don't want any problems, complaints or returns. The goal is a perfect fit.

With this in mind, I brought to the machine shop a Packard engine block with rear main cap, an Olds oil pump, a Packard oil pump and one of Craig's last production adapters. Invaluable is a copy of an engineering drawing of the Oldsmobile oil pump, provided by Reyman Branting, one of our east coast members.

This drawing established the angle of the Olds oil pump base to be 4 degrees, 11 minutes. Inspection of the base of the adapter produced on the manual mill showed it to be 4 degrees even. This slight difference would change the angle of the drive shaft. Again, this is not an indication of fault. It is just taking precision of the part and fitment accuracy to the next level.

Further inspection indicated the Olds oil pump input was not precisely centered over the hole in the Packard main cap and thus the drive shaft was at a slight angle. Again, for manual work it was acceptable, but we're going to be making a bunch of these on a CNC mill and once we get one perfect, they'll all be perfect.

As of today, the steel blanks for the adapters are roughed out. The CNC program is written, but will be modified as we solve these minor fitment issues. We'll do one test unit, check the fit next weekend and hope to have finished kits on the shelf by the end of November.

Question for the members - would you prefer the kit to be offered complete, with a choice or regular or high volume pump?

thnx, jack vines

Jack: Terrifically good work, as I expected you would do.

When my local machinist went down with knee surgery, that was the end of that as far as local production was concerned.

The fact that you are correcting minor irregularities in the adapter kit is to your credit. Generally, the kit worked for everybody. But perfection is to be sought and you are the guy to do it.

I have to say that anyone who has a Packard V-8 and does NOT buy this conversion is "whistling past the graveyard."

Craig

I rather like the option of buying either a complete kit or just the bare adapter with instructions as Craig originally sold.

There are several here with the HV kit installed -- apparently without issue-- but seem to remember one fellow with a Golden Hawk who installed the high volume pump and had leak issues around a seal. Believe he reverted to a regular volume Olds pump on his car which solved the problem. Wonder if anyone remembers if he figured out why he had the issue. That might be something to consider as to which pump if more than one had problems.

"This drawing established the angle of the Olds oil pump base to be 4 degrees, 11 minutes. Inspection of the base of the adapter produced on the manual mill showed it to be 4 degrees even. "

THe angle dimension of the pump drawing is irrelevant. What is the angle to the PACKARD block? NOT the Olds block.

That is to say, the angle dimension on the drawing for the Olds pump was for fitment to an OLDS engine NOT a Packard engine.

Bottom line: the shaft of the pump must be concentric and parallel with the PACKARD distributor shaft. For all we know the Olds distributor might have set on an 11 minute angle. DO u have a drawing for the Olds engine????

Mock up the set up first with alignment shafts thru the distributor and the pump body and other gaugings.

Unless u have qualified prints of the Packard block, Olds block and pump then reverse eng'ring is the only possibility. Draw pictures later.

I would offer the kits without the pump, and let people buy the pump locally. Here's the reason: when you buy the pump locally it comes with a lifetime warranty. You don't want to be warrantying the pumps themselves, and the pumps are available at ANY parts store, usually with a lifetime warranty. I'd supply all the parts to put the pump on, and if the owner happens to get a defective pump, they can deal with it locally instead of having to deal with it with you. Just my

I want to buy my own pump localy.

I suppose one could get an EXCLUSIVE on the offering of a complete kit w/pump by doing the following:

Alter the angle on the pump flange by a few minutes and compensate the adpater plate accordingly. That way the kit and any future replacement pumps would have to be bought thru the original kit supplier.

Eric

There only one problem with that. The pump manufacturer will NEVER own up to the fact that their pump is defective, especially when you have to admit that it is being used in an application that they themselves did not intend. I had an experience along those lines and it was not a custom application and it was with a Melling pump. I kept twistng the shaft and there were always little pieces of teflon in the impellers which cause them to jam and twist the pump shaft(we could never figure out where they came from). This was on a Dodge 400 rebuilt engine that was done by one of the top rebuilders in the area who also built race engines. I went thru 4 pumps before finally getting rid of the truck(good news was it caused me to get my 1 ton dually). Melling would never admit that their pumps were defective, they kept insisting that my mechanic was at fault. And this was a standard application. You will go thru the tortures of the damned trying to get any mfg. to admit fault in this case.

Al

I've never had any problems exchanging parts at Oreilly's Autozone, Advanced Auto, or any other parts store. I just take it in, tell them it doesn't work, they either give me my money back or a new part. When you go pick up the pump for the first time, don't tell them it's going into a Packard, you say "I need an oil pump for a 1970 Olds Delta 88 with the 455 engine in it". They will come up with two versions, standard and high volume, you want the high volume. When you get the receipt, it'll say "1970 Oldsmobile" on it, that's the vehicle it's warranted for. Sometimes the less people know about what you are doing the better. It's not lying, it's "withholding information". Don't feel bad about doing it, the Government does it many times a day every day.

That's great! I bought a pump a while back hoping someone would be building the adapters.

Craig,
I have one of the kits you sold and was planning to install this winter when I pull motor for complete gasket and seal replacement. Now knowing about small machining difference has anyone had any problems with the first units? If not then it will be a part of my 352 next travel season.
Bill

ps:Of the two Olds pumps use the HV one?