Packard Forum Index » Post-War (1946-54)

I should have emphasized the way I attached the sill plates on my Packard. It is easy to do and looks authentic. Most importantly you can easily remove them.

I bought strips of sticky back velcro tape from a local upholstery supply store called UFO. There are several widths and I think I used 1 inch. You buy equal lengths of the two mating types of velcro. All you have to do is cut the velcro to length and stick them on the car where the sill plates go. Just clean the surface with wax remover or some other good solvent like brake cleaner.
I used 3 strips convenient to the way the door sill is made.

The mating velcro strips on the back of the sill plates should line up with the strips on the car within 1/8"or so. Take some measurements, cut them to length and stick them on. Put the sill plates on the and the velcro will hold them. If you get the sill plate slightly off position just pull it off and put it on again.

The whole job can be done in a hour and it looks authentic. Putting the sill plates on with glue is a disaster if you ever have to remove them. The costly steel backing and clips is expensive and not necessary. Screws work but spoil the authentic look.

The velcro sounds like a good idea and one I will probably do. A question though on the removal of the sill plates for those who have been around these models far more than I.

My rubber was deteriorated enough that the edge of metal backing plate could be seen so that plus the conversation here made it relatively easy to figure out what had to be done. Which direction to pull from was not obvious until the first plate was pulled though. On a car with decent rubber that might have been an issue even knowing a plate was used.

Was there a special tool to get under the inside edge or a procedure ever published telling how to remove those pieces and not damage the molding piece. With good rubber going right up to the metal it seems as if it would be extremely easy to damage good molding trying to find some way to pry it up.

I spoke to the Studebaker archivist today since the numbers he had didn't match those I found on this site. Apparently
they changed the numbers in the '54 parts list. Some of you regulars may know that, but it's not apparent from the only list I found on this site. So if anyoen has a '49-50 parts book it would be an nice addition here. Museum has one but I didn't inquire.
The old original numbers are 399226&227. 396540&541 show in '54.
He's mailing out the dwg so I should have next week. After that I'll be able to get cost info. I realistically wouldn't think it possible to have anything until early next year, holdays, etc.
HH - All I did to get mind off, was take a pry driver and lift on SS piece on the carpet side edge on the two big clips that attach to the floor pans. Once they're up, the clips can be disingaged rather easily by the same technique. The front are the same as spring type trim clips. The outer clips are large with rounded wedges so to come off from an upright angled position. I can do pictures if you need.

Quote:

Interesting. That must be a difference between 21st and 22-23 series.

For anyone interested, 21st 4dr sedan has 7 sheet metal screws on front door and 3 on the back door holding a piece of ordinary metal to the floor. I wonder if a 2 door is similar or if the screws are a 4 door only thing. One side of the metal is shaped into a U shape and the SS is wrapped over that U side & held by a turned over edge. The rubber is mounted on a separate piece which is held by the clips and is flush against SS. After removing the first one, I found the clips on inside have to lift up first so the outer clips can slide inward and then up out of slots. SS stays in position so it makes it hard to get anything in to pry the inside of rubber up & get the plate started without putting pressure on the SS or the paint on the jambs.

The difference in part numbers is a mystery. Packard went to a lot of effort to update superseded part numbers in the 1955-56 parts book index, but neither of these sets of numbers appear there.

I have an original 22nd Series parts list from December 1948 which shows the same 396540-41 numbers in Group 30.806 as the 1948-54 list.

Also, note that Group 30.806 for Scuff Plates is for the stainless steel trim strip that is screwed to the floor pan, not the rubber mat assembly.

The rubber mats are listed under Group 30.8105 in the parts list and the numbers are 396522-23 for the 2 door models.

That's why I like to work from drawings/specifications not hearsay. Eliminates alot of confusion. I'm feeling I'm at the 23 series learning curve spot where I need Schaum's outline for Packard restoration and Packard restoration for Dummies!
I posted a separate correction on the removal. A second or third look is often telling. Our brains fill in the spaces.
I can only go from what the Studebaker archivist said on the phone about the P/Ns.
I was sure I was on the right track because the SS trim drawing (copy in my possession) shows the 396540's assembly numbers which are in the '54 parts list. Technically, if it's a separate unrelated part it would not be listed or referenced on/to the assembly drawing. Neither PAC nor Studebaker could find the right drawings under that P/N? (but it's on the drawing?) So I hope I get the "right" drawings this week. Or they'll be another correction post. I'll get it right. Keeping quiet til then on this...
Again shows the value of this site but also the pitfalls of too many views. My first hunch, put roll rubber on it is still looking good.

Keep in mind that the parts books only include numbers for parts that were supplied for service replacement in the field, but the use of part numbers extends beyond that.

In manufacturing, there are three types of materials - finished goods, semi-finished good, and raw materials. Part numbers are applied to every item in the manufacturing inventories, including those parts and subassemblies used in vehicle assembly, but not all of those parts were offered, publicly, for service.

So, it might be that what the SNM has located is a drawing/number for an item that required further work before it was introduced into the parts warehouse system for packaging and distribution. Else, perhaps what was used on the line significantly differed in what was provided for service. Either way, the drawing/part number that the SNM has located might be referenced on another drawing for the finished service part - merely a matter of some text on 'A' size paper (similar to letter size paper), but the SNM simply hasn't found it or doesn't have it.

You migth wanna contact the folks at the Proving Grounds as a cross-check.

Thanks. I'm glad there's so much concern on this.
This is under review and until I receive the dwgs and find out what's what, I'm not commenting, aka "engineering hold".
I've checked the P/N's in the '54 list several times for what it lists for the 2365. The SS trim drawing PAC sent is dated 11/'46. That dwg indicates the '54 P/L rubber mat number for the SS trim piece(?) and references the assy by the same #(?) on the same dwg. There's also a note "sample to receive approval before purchase". But I'm not jumping to conclusions. I've got some more cross reference source materials coming. My back up is to redraw the part from my original.
I'm also aware of how drawings used to be made and sometimes because of hand drawing cost or resource allocation, the hand drawns weren't updated. It takes an engineering dominated company to be diligent on that. Vendor manufacture drawings are probably more accurate. So these were sourced by some company but that's another mystery/possible dead end for later. Any info on that would be valuable. One could specualte there could be a later version somewhere or it's no longer around. I'm used to PM's stamping "approved for construction" or something to indicate they were checked prior to release for purchase or manufacture.

Ah yes, hand-drawn (as opposed to the convenience of CAD). As such, the draftsmen would add changes, and needed, and edit the artwork, dimensions, and other details, and even adding subsequent parts numbers - all on the same drawing, and possibly multiple times. Yet, perhaps because current production was the priority, history could literally be erased in the process - unless they took care to preserve prior details.

I didn't take drafting classes back in HS (and looking back, now, I wish I had), and most of what I know about automotive engineering drawings comes from combing the (sloppy) collection at the former Avanti works in Yo., OH, back on the late 80s. Nearly all of the Studebaker drawings in their possession were blueprints, which I suspect came from the original assembly line, rather than the engineering office/vault in So. Bend. Occasionally, I found not only 'A' sized drawings pointing to another vendor drawing/number, but some vendor-supplied drawing that had been relabelled with a Stude P/N.

However, let me reiterate the point, if only for the benefit of the viewing audience, that a blueprint is only a snapshot from a given point in time; only the original engineering (drawing white vellum) would tell the full story. I can only imagine what a task it must have been for an automaker, back then, to just store, index, and maintain a collection of engineering drawings, and distribute updated blueprints not only to the plant(s), but to and from the field.

Although I don't own an affected vehicle, I look forward to seeing how the story continues to unfold. Meanwhile, I think you're spot-on to want to redraw, specificaly for your application, once you're confident that you have all the details.

Keep up the good work!

BdeB - You're lucky for me!
After more scrutiny and more info, the '54 list does NOT show the mat assy under 30.8105 for the 2 dr 23 series(65, 75, 85, 95, etc.). All it shows are the "clips" both P/Ns for "inner" and outer.
Just my luck I'd get the runt of the litter vehicle...
So the '48-50 parts list must be consulted for the correct parts/P/Ns.
I'm ordering a set of "scuff plates", aka SS carpet trim, from MAX. Hopefully, the new dwgs will be for the rubber mat. Keep ya posted.