Packard Forum Index » Modification Discussion

I am the proud new owner of a lovely 1941 Packard Club Coupe, which has been fully restored over many years. One of the things I'm not so happy about is that it was converted to 12 volt electrics somewhere along the way. This works fine, but the alternator is a bit of an eyesore. I see someone in the US produces 12V (?) alternators in generator casings. Has anybody had experience with one of these?

Second question. The car is now fitted with turn signals, a very handy safety measure since it's LHD. The front signals are nicely integrated into the sidelights with an orange globe - surprisingly effective - but the rear are tacked on bullet lamps which look out of place. Has anybody found a way to integrate the rear turn signal lamps into the standard rear lamp housings? Yes, it would be red (not orange) but could be made more visible with an LED globe? I expect to use the car fairly regularly on the road (on club plates).

Any advice appreciated.

As to replacing the modern looking alternator, there are a couple of possibilities. Powergenqualitypowerauto.com has an alternator that looks like a generator at not too terrible a price. Gener-Natorgener-nator.com will custom build an alternator into an original generator case. Unless you want a perfect look that custom method is rather expensive. The Powergen approach is well established, available thru several stores, and used by many -- even 6v versions -- but does look more modern than the generators of the 40s. The custom item is also used by many and have heard no complaints other than price. One downside to the custom item is if anything goes wrong with it repair could possibly be difficult if there are any non standard parts used which are available only from the conversion company.

On the turn signals, I don't know if there is enough room on the plate the existing lamp socket uses in mounting to the tail light housing since the prewar junior lights are somewhat small to contain two fairly large bulbs. If there is space, one possible way would be to copy the 160-180 models that had a turn signal option and add a second single filament lamp socket and bulb to that plate. I don't know enough about the outer housings and how they compare styling and size wise but it might even be possible to find a set of senior lights that already have the socket.

To add a socket, universal aftermarket sockets are readily available. I believe the push in mounting method for the universal sockets require less space than the Packard crimped on sockets so maybe one could be installed in the space available. If there is not enough room and the plate is removable or could be cut out, maybe make a new plate and space the holes for the two new sockets in that plate. With either approach, just be sure to space for the glass bulb needs inside the housing.

Since the wiring for turn signals is part of your aftermarket turn signal setup the wires are already present in the trunk area so you would just run the wire now going to the bullet light to the new socket and bulb for the turn signal.

One question might be if that approach would work for what seems to be some strict lighting requirements. I remember some prior forum discussions from others in Oz on needing to add turn signals to imported US cars that did not originally have them. It would seem that perhaps your regulations are somewhat specific and it might be worth checking to see if the red light would work since the aftermarket switch would probably give it away as not being original.

The parking lights and taillights starting in 1940 were wired for dual element bulbs so should be easy to add a column switch and wire in to use as turn signals without having to add or hang odd lights off of the body. My 1940 had a switch with a rubber wheel that even made it self-cancel the signal when the wheel was straightened again after a turn. My 1941 had a very similar setup. It takes a little wiring but once done, the brake light elements will double as turn signals.

The front dual element bulbs were for some reason present in most of the cars even without turn signals but the second filament was not used and the extra wire disconnected and tucked away. In the rear the dual elements were used for brake and tail lights with bulbs in parallel so both R and L sides lit at once. I am not sure if there were any unused wires in the body looms for use with turn signals unless the car came factory equipped with the option but it seems unlikely given the cost of wire. There are different tail light assys having one or two bulbs so am sure the rear turn signal bulbs and sockets were not present without the option. That was still the way in 21st and 22nd series cars.

Prior to the 23rd series with the change from a 3 to a 6 wire turn signal switch that could take the brake light signal and disconnect it from the dual filament bulbs and connect the turn signal flasher instead, there was a separate single filament bulb for rear turn signals in all Packard factory systems. The 6 wire switch also required a change in the body loom so the dual element rear bulbs could be operated independently. That also did not happen until the 23rd series.

'PowerGen' is a product line produced by PowerMaster Motorsports doing business in West Chicago, IL, USA. Seepowermastermotorsports.com/
The link supplied by HH56 is one of PowerMaster's dealers . . . that happens to be the dealer I used . . . but there may be one in Australia.
Here's a photo of the 'PowerGen' option installed in a 22nd series car. PowerMaster's design is to package the alternator close to the pulley end, and add a simple thin walled cylinder to the 'back-end' to achieve the length desired. In the depicted installation the cylinder was removed, modified, and reinstalled to add a dummy field pole connection. The alternator is supplied with one location to mount/attach the output wire. The AutoLite identification tag was installed with a bit of black RTV (it is not included with the PowerGen). These products are available in 6 and 12 volt configurations and various width pulleys. Depicted is a 6 volt, positive ground, wide belt item. Having converted to 12 volt I believe you will be able to buy a PowerGen with a provision for an indicator light (aka 'idiot light').

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Is your belt the large 356 belt and if so, do you remember which pulley you used and does it fit the belt well? I have been unable to find a stock pulley at the regular alternator places large enough for the almost 1" wide belt. I have been told there is one place that will custom make a wide belt pulley at an additional charge if you buy their alternator but theirs is a modern looking alternator.

Howard;
Sorry about the belt width vagueness. I believe this pulley is identified as 5/8 - 3/4, which I believe is correct for the 22nd series. The pulley was offered by PowerMaster as a 'dealer installed' option. If 'b.wilson' requires a wider width, I would think the geometry of the pulley would not be a challenge for a local machinist to produce. At least in that way the performance of the alternator and the speed range of the engine could be optimized, with a goal of 'on-line' alternator operation at low idle.

dp

Thanks for the info. For his 120 b.wilson is probably OK with one of the optional pulleys offered by the alternator places.

Those of us with the 356 engines are the ones needing something wider than the largest pulley that seems to be currently offered. Mike couldn't find anything and after a lot of discussion sent his generator pulley to the place he bought his alternator from to see what they could do. They made him a custom pulley which fits their modern looking alternator (same standard 6v unit available from several places) but from what others have reported don't seem anxious in getting into the business of making the pulleys available separately. Was just hoping you had found something workable.

There is at least one company here in Australia fitting modern alternators into original casings.
C.A.E. Performance Pty Ltd.
caenterprises.com.au/products.php
phone 03 5472 1442.
They advertise in "Restored Cars" magazine.

Thanks for all the info, guys. Very helpful.

The Powergen product looks pretty good. There's something similar made locally in Australia, but I'd probably end up with one resembling a Lucas generator since I don't have an original generator casing and don't know what brand (Delco etc) the car originally came with. How hard would it be to find an original generator - presumably non-functioning - as a donor item?

It never occurred to me that there might already be wiring in the loom for turn signals. I'll investigate more closely, and see whether I can rig up something where the brake light doubles as the turn signal lamp. That would avoid changing or modifying the rear light fitting. Yes, there is theoretically an issue with amber vs red rear turn signals in Australia, but having them integrated into the existing lamps makes them less obvious (and the car predates the design rule requiring turn signals). To me, it's more a safety issue.

I'm about to post another question, about the clock.

Thanks again Brian W.