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transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#1
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West Peterson
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My search abilities failed to bring up the answer I'm looking for, but perhaps I just didn't type in the correct word sequence, I don't know...
If this question is redundant, I apologize.
I've also posted my question on the AACA Forum, so again, if anyone finds that offensive/redundant/obnoxious, I'm sorry.

A service procedure recommended by Packard in 1940 suggested putting in 250 weight oil in my transmission/overdrive as a first step to try and eliminate some rattling noises that appear at a certain speed.

When I serviced the car after 40 years of storage, the oil I put in was about 80 weight, which I'm sure is sufficient for lubrication purposes. However, I'm hearing what I think is the rattling noise mentioned in the service letter. My thought is to find as thick of an oil as I can, put it in, and see if the sound changes tone or is eliminated. If the sound does not change, I should be able to conclude that the rattling noise is coming from something else (driveshaft, possibly being unbalanced and causing vibration elsewhere).
My question is, where do I find 250 weight oil, or something close to it?

Posted on: 2008/3/28 9:12
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#2
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Randy Berger
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http://www.restorationstuff.com/Catalog/RSC%20No23%20web3.pdf
Look on page 10 (or thereabouts)
You're welcome

Posted on: 2008/3/28 9:31
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#3
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JWL
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West, for what it is worth I offer the following. I have a 1973 Datsun 240Z. The car had a noisy transmission and differential. This condition had persisted since the car was new, according to the previous owner's log. I drained and refilled the units with Red Line synthetic 85W-140 gear oil. This took care of almost all of the noise. I was impressed by the remarkable change. I don't know if this oil is compatiable with your transmission and overdrive, but thought you might like this information. I have a 115C and using an EP 85W-140 gear oil in its transmission and differential. This oil seems to be working just fine. John

Posted on: 2008/3/28 9:50
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#4
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West Peterson
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Thanks, Randy and John
Great stuff from Restoration Supply Company. In the latest issue of Antique Automobile, I put in a four-page story about what that family went through when the fires went through their place two years ago.

"250W gear oil. A heaver, tacky cohesive oil for transmissions and rear axles where heavier oil is required. It can also be used with spiral/bevel or older hypoid gears. LubriPlate SPO-288"

Posted on: 2008/3/28 10:04
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#5
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Owen_Dyneto
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The gear oil that many of us use in standard transmissions and overdrives, steering gear boxes and differentials, as previously noted, is SAE EP 85W-140. If your trans or OD makes noises with this, using a heavier oil is probably just forestalling the inevitable failure and probably further damage will result -- best to find the source of the problem sooner rather than later.

Posted on: 2008/3/28 10:14
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#6
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West Peterson
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I was thinking that putting in the thicker oil would be my tell-tale. If the noise continues at the same "tone", I would then look into different areas for the source. If the tone changes or is eliminated, my search would end. But, as you state, my work begins.
You see, I have no idea where the noise is eminating, with several long-time experts riding with me and being a bit puzzled. When I was looking at an original pieces of Packard literature this weekend, that's when I found this service piece that goes along with the film strips they had for mechanics. The thicker oil was only the first step... the next steps are not going to be fun, but at least I'd know I've tracked down the source.
It's not a constant rattle, just at certain speeds, which is what the service slide-show was talking about as well.
I may have put in the 85-140 as you have. At this point, I don't remember. I do remember the 80 or 85, number, but perhaps forgot about the 140. I'm going to give the 250 a shot and I'll let you know how it turns out.

Posted on: 2008/3/28 12:04
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#7
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Peter Packard
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G'day all, This may be a bit after the horses have bolted but for my 2 cents, I would be cautious about using a modern Sulphur EP or a 140 weight oil in a Packard O'D as they really need some thrash of oil in the system. The o'd's have two oil levels and apart from oil levels, you have to be careful not to use a friction modified oil in them. They do have some noises, mostly due to the failure of the piss-ant crush washer in the R6 and the general wear and tear over 50 years for the R6, R9 and R10 and R11. I would counsel to use a non EP 85 - 140 in the box as the use of a sulphur enhanced EP oil should not be recommended for the roller type o'd boxes with bronze bushes in the lay shafts. There are non EP oils available which avoid Sulphur as an EP agent and are readily available for older vehicles.
Having said that, restoration and maintenance on a 70 year old car/ bike / whatever, is very much a personal decision and you can put in whatever you want. Best Regards. Peter Toet

Posted on: 2008/3/29 8:05
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#8
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Owen_Dyneto
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A valid comment about the compatibility of some EP gear oils with transmissions/ODs with bronze parts; I've read that same caution myself several times years back. I can only say based on using EP 85W-140 in my R-9 for 2 decades that I never had any problems and the unit was silent.

Posted on: 2008/3/29 8:37
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#9
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Thomas Wilcox
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I can say after having used EP oils in the differential of a 34 that my ring gears got quite pitted. Now, was this due to the oil, or something else, I can't say. But the corrosion of parts while soaked in oil was somewhat mysterious. Interestingly, they ran quite silent. Also saw corrosion in a bronze steering gear bushing, though that may have been pressure due to a worn out front end.

Just my observations on EP oils and bronze.

Tom

Posted on: 2008/3/29 10:41
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Thomas Wilcox
34 Roadster, [url=https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/r
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Re: transmission/overdrive oil for R-9
#10
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Owen_Dyneto
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Tom, the differential on a 32 and up Packard is a hypoid type which mandates use of an EP gear oil, though it certainly isn't required in the transmission or steering gear box. Without it your ring and pinion will scuff severely. Perhaps the corrosion/pitting you saw was from long storage with condensation in the oil? On the half-dozen 34 Packard differentials I've looked at that sat for decades, there was lots of pitting, especially near the interface of the oil and air. Perhaps a straight GL-1 gear oil is a better choice for the steering gear and transmission, these are just straight mineral oils with defoamer added.

Posted on: 2008/3/29 13:59
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