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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Quite a regular
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 50
Owen, that's the one. Mr. Roberts and his wife were very helpful.

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/6 15:09:07
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
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Joined:
2007/3/14 16:01
From New Jersey
Posts: 15719
Yeah, he makes and offers some beautifully crafted parts. And I think he makes every water jacket plate except mine which is a 1-year only design.

Posted on: 11/6 16:37:02
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Quite a regular
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 50
I spent a few hours this last Saturday prepping the last of the major components for the engine rebuild. My brother-in-law and I cleaned off all the old gaskets and sealant from all parts, and chased all the bolts with dies to clean up the threads that had been rounded off/stretched. This all took a surprising amount of time.

The block is getting the finishing touches at the machine shop this week, and the crankshaft should be done with balance as well. Then it's just waiting for the water jacket and the new oil filter and we have everything we need.

The crankcase and oil pain are going to get sent through a large parts washer to clean out the metal shavings.

Here's the underside of the crankcase with most everything in place.


And if you have 10 minutes to kill, here's a time-lapse video of the whole process. I'm the guy in the light gray shirt.

Posted on: 11/11 16:07:51
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Quite a regular
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 50
Ran into a bit of an issue with the water jacket. It arrived, and I'm not so sure that it's the right one. First of all, it's labeled for a '29-'32 Packard Standard 8, and I'm rebuilding a 1938 Super 8 (using a '39 block). I have no idea if the mounting holes even line up. The length is 32", so should be same as what came off. I haven't been able to test fit because the car and engine are two hours away.

The water distribution holes are different as well. Different location and different diameter. Is this a problem? Also, the water distribution plate sticks "out" from the the mounting surface. Is this how it's supposed to be? Remember, the old water jacket we pulled off was modified so I have no idea if it's right or not.

The new one:


The old one:


I guess the big question is how different is the '38-39 Super 8 block from the '32 Standard 8? I've read the whole "Packard: A History" book, but I don't remember the small details like this. And I've never seen a '32 block....

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/20 16:30:18
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Forum Ambassador
Joined:
2007/3/14 16:01
From New Jersey
Posts: 15719
Have you asked the vendor these questions, he's been supplying these for some time and probably has all the original prints. To my knowledge the only 320 water jacket plate that is different is 1934, a one year only design due to the oil cooler mounting.

Posted on: 11/20 16:58:53
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Quite a regular
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 50
Sorry, I should have mentioned that I have been talking to the vendor. He has this specific water jacket (the one I was shipped) labeled for '29-32. He seems to be more concerned that the outer mounting holes are correct, and less worried about the water distribution holes.

And that's where my question lies....assuming the jacket mounts properly up to the '39 block, the water distribution holes are different than what I pulled off and what another member showed earlier in the thread. I have no idea if this is a problem. The vendor doesn't think it matters much. I'm totally clueless....I've never even heard of a water jacket before working on this engine.

Posted on: 11/20 21:15:09
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
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Joined:
2007/5/20 1:34
From Bowral, Southern Highlands of NSW, Australia
Posts: 10246
Quote:
kevinpackard wrote:Sorry, I should have mentioned that I have been talking to the vendor..... He seems to be more concerned that the outer mounting holes are correct, and less worried about the water distribution holes.

And that's where my question lies....assuming the jacket mounts properly up to the '39 block, the water distribution holes are different than what I pulled off and what another member showed earlier in the thread. I have no idea if this is a problem. The vendor doesn't think it matters much....


The holes in the distribution tube ARE important. I believe they are there to direct water/coolant to the hottest areas in the engine, typically the exhaust valve area. If the holes aren't properly aligned all they're likely to do is flow water/coolant against the outside of the cylinders. This could make for potential overheating problems and cracked e/valve seats and/or cracks into the cylinders from the e/valve seats.

It's been some years since I saw a water distribution cover off a 320 engine but I seem to remember the inside "distribution" metal piece with the holes in it tapered in depth from front to rear. IE deeper at the front narrowing down at the rear.

If I'm wrong, someone please correct me. Photo or photos would be welcome.

ADD - Found this post of mine from long ago. Don't know if it helps.

Posted on: 11/20 23:12:59
_________________
Mal
/o[]o\
====


"Out of chaos comes order" - Nietzsche.

'38 Eight Sedan 38's are great! (Sold July 2009)
'41 120 Club Coupe 41's the One! (Sold October 2017)
'48 2222 "Almost" Rolling Limo Chassis and Engine (Sold Sept 2019)
'50 Eight Touring Sedan

Project Blogs:
'41 120 Club Coupe - Locked
Wade's Workshop - Locked
'50 Eight Touring Sedan

What's this? >>>>>> FAQ - Add your Packard to the Owners Registry
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Quite a regular
Joined:
2008/10/27 6:47
From Ellensburg, WA
Posts: 50
That is helpful. The hole pattern you show is exactly what ours looked like when we took it off, as well as the '37 Super 8 that was shown earlier in the thread. I'm leaning more and more towards sending the new one back and have correct holes made.

The mechanic who is helping us with the rebuild thinks that the original overheat was caused by a couple things
1. PO installed thermostat, preventing free flow of water
2. Poorly fabricated water jacket inner plate
3. Space between the water pump impeller and the housing, creating turbulence

I'll provide pictures of the damage when I'm able to. He's also concerned that the water distribution holes don't line up where he thinks there supposed to...between the cylinders is what I remember him saying is where they should be. Not correct?

-Kevin

Posted on: 11/21 9:01:01
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Re: 1938 Super 8 1605 - adventures with a newbie
Forum Ambassador
Joined:
2007/5/20 1:34
From Bowral, Southern Highlands of NSW, Australia
Posts: 10246
Quote:
kevinpackard wrote:....He's also concerned that the water distribution holes don't line up where he thinks there supposed to...between the cylinders is what I remember him saying is where they should be. Not correct?


Between the cylinders is also what I remember. Allows the "cooler" water to get to the inside of the cylinders where the valves are.

Posted on: 11/21 11:57:48
_________________
Mal
/o[]o\
====


"Out of chaos comes order" - Nietzsche.

'38 Eight Sedan 38's are great! (Sold July 2009)
'41 120 Club Coupe 41's the One! (Sold October 2017)
'48 2222 "Almost" Rolling Limo Chassis and Engine (Sold Sept 2019)
'50 Eight Touring Sedan

Project Blogs:
'41 120 Club Coupe - Locked
Wade's Workshop - Locked
'50 Eight Touring Sedan

What's this? >>>>>> FAQ - Add your Packard to the Owners Registry
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