Packard Forum Index » Pre-War (1899-1942)

I've come across a 1940 Packard 160 coupe. It is a column shift standard 3-speed without overdrive.

1. What year did Packard go from floor shift to column shift?

2. As a guess, what percentage of 1940 160s would have had overdrive?

3. What, other than shortening the driveshaft, control cable and wiring would be required to switch to overdrive?

4. Again, as a WAG, what is market price for a complete overdrive setup?

Thanks in advance?

jack vines

Greetings I do believe that 1938 was the last year for "floor shift" and 38 was also the first year for an "all steal" body.

[quote]
1. What year did Packard go from floor shift to column shift\?
[quote]

1939 was the first year for column shift and also for overdrive

The 1939 overdrive was an R6, R9 for 1940 to 1948 and R11 for late 1948 to 1950

There were 2 different versions of the R9. The regular R9 was used for the junior 6 and 8 cylinder cars. Senior cars with the 356 engine used an R9A which had a 4 pinion planetary instead of 3 and a larger one way clutch.

....and Jack, please note there is no error in the orientation of the cylinders. Some Packards did not come with V8's. What are you doing over on this side of the tracks?
As for a price on an R9A, very hard to pinpoint due to the required components. If at all possible, get a complete setup out of a parts car.

I do believe that 1938 was the last year for "floor shift" and 38 was also the first year for an "all steal" body.

Partially correct. 1939 was the last year for cane or floor shift though the column-shift option was very popular. Of the few 39s you see with cane shift, almost all are Twelves.

1938 was not the first year for "all steel" bodies, the Twelves were still composite wood/steel in 1939.

My engine machinist just bought this car and we're looking forward to playing with the long arn.

If an earlier floor shift were found, the basic tranny is pretty much the same, correct?

jack vines

I'm Pretty certain the post war trans will bolt up to the 40 Super 8. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. The only thing left is the cable, kick down, wiring, and relay. Which can be taken from the post war car. After 1948 the overdrive light was also gone, but so what?.

Would it be correct to say the Packard overdrive transmission didn't change from '39-54?

(Naturally, I've got three '55-56 Borg-Warner T85s from the Studebaker Golden Hawk, but those don't fit the long eights.)

jack vines

They did change. The R6 in 39, R9 from 40 thru mid 48 and then in 48 a change from the R9 to the R11 in mid 22nd series production. R11 lasted until the end of production. Mechanically essentially the same although the case was different 51-4 and then again 55-6.

R9's are quite different mechanically as well as being electrically more complex. The R11 is a much more refined unit with simple electrics. It was made available via kits when R9 supply ran out and also for those owners experiencing problems with R9 equipped cars who wished to buy the upgrade.

The pre V8 complete transmission & R11 assy will bolt in place of the trans & R9 equipped on most cars but there are some major details that also need to change if the conversion is made. The R9 is a good unit but does have issues if things are not kept in very good order. If you have the option to get the R11 complete, it would probably be more advantageous but would not be correct for the year -- although there are some on the forum running the R11 in prewar cars.

1949 Service Counselor Vol 23 #2 details the differences between the R9 and 11. 1947 Vol 21 #15 details one of the issues and main reason for the change and kit. Vol 23 #4 details the kit a little and has instructions on how to install & what needs to change if the kit is installed.

Quote:

No, as noted by HH56 there were changes.

Easiest bolt-in would be a 1940 to 1950 transmission with overdrive, either R9 or R11. The 1939 would also fit but would be very hard to find due to the R6 overdrive. The 1951 to 1954 units had a longer tailshaft that may or may not fit easily in the 1940 chassis.

Transmissions used with the 356 engine had a larger diameter input shaft and front cover than those from other models but are otherwise the same internally.

As for changing from column to floor shift you would need to modify the cover and shifter assembly from an earlier car. This is explained in some detail in the following thread by Peter Packard.

Adapting 1938 top loader to R-11