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Mal,

clipper47 here talked about the difficulties he encountered installing a new clutch in his 47 Clipper with the 356 engine. Maybe Dave will pick up on this or you may want to PM him for how he solved the release fork - clutch cover interface problem.

(o[]o)

Thursday 17th May 2012

Today was spent on the valves. First all were removed, inlets as well as the exhausts, even though the inlets seemed to be functioning OK. A fair number of the exhaust valves resisted easy removal necessitating inserting "spacers" gradually increasing in size and rotating the crank to force the valve another 1/4" or so higher each time. Valves were lifted until the bottom of the stem was flush with the bottom of the valve guide. Then a number of techniques were employed, penetrant, rotation while lifting, returning the valve down the guide, up and down movement, brute force or a combination of one or more of these. Result, all valves were finally released from the 356's grip upon them. Just as well all the valves came out because some of the inlets needed attention too. Then, while I cleaned up the heads of all the valves, Wade removed and cleaned up each of the lifters. Wade also went round to Brookers Brakes and was able to borrow a reamer to clean out the valve guides. Reaming done, lapping in the valves was next. But, starting at #1 exhaust, soon realised it needed more than a manual valve grind. So again off went Wade to Brookers. Returned the reamer but had taken all the valves with him. Brookers reground the valve faces while he waited and even lent him a couple of valve seat re-facing cutters to recut the faces for both the inlets, 30 degrees, and exhausts, 45 degrees. As I said earlier it was just as well all the valves came out, some requiring much more surgery than others before all the pits and perfections were removed. Then onto lapping in the valves. Wade had 3 old, very old, containers of lapping paste. One of which had accompanied him to Sydney about 50 years ago and only had a skerrick of paste left in it, as you'd expect. Of the other two, one was so dried out it was binned straight away while the other provided enough dried paste which when well mixed with oil provided a reasonable paste for the lapping exercise. Almost through the lapping when Noel arrived, after calling earlier, and dropped in another clutch fork. The fork he delivered is the same or similar to a 120 fork and is thinner so stands some chance of fitting. But that'll be on Mondays to do list along with re-installing the valves, because there's no work tomorrow. The funeral of a friend closing the workshop for all the guys there. But I'll miss out on Monday because of another Packard happening. I'll be with Peter Packard, his wife Ann and Noel for the pickup of the '38 Barrymore Twelve from Belmont, north of Sydney. A more than fair compensation, I'd say, for missing a day at the workshop!

Quote:John,

Thanks for the tip but a solution might be at hand as noted above. If not, I'll use your suggestion as backup.

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Mal, I always very much enjoy reading your posts - given how long some are I hope you touch-type and arent' a 2-finger typist.

For the amount of valve work that Wade does, I'd think he'd already own or be on the lookout for a power valve seat grinder kit. The one pictured below I picked up maybe 30 years back for something like $25; I still see them occasionally at auto flea markets. I did have to invest in some new stones a while back but I've probably done 30 or more valve grinds with this kit, mostly Packards. I do pay a machine shop to reface the valves and when both surfaces are so machined, I follow the advice of some old time references and don't hand-lap though I do check the contact with some radial soft pencil lines across the faces, or occasionally I use Prussian Blue.

To me the worst part of a thorough valve job is changing exhaust guides, especially #8 where the curvature of the cowl on most models inhibits a good swing of the hammer.

I also noticed Wade's numbered cardboard holder to retain the valves in order. A good rainy day or winter project is to make a little rack like the one below, not that it works any better.

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Quote:Dave,

Not even 2 fingers! Basically one finger, middle right, with a little assistance from the left forefinger for left sided keys like shift, caps lock and tab! Even then I get it wrong, don't know how many posts I've lost because of hitting the wrong key! Plus I'm sure the keyboard letters move around. How is it possible that I make the many spelling mistakes found when proof reading?

Regarding the valve grinding gear, I'm sure Wade would snap one up if he found one. It was only last year he finally came across a king pin reaming set and bought that. I like your valve holding rack, a lot sturdier than floppy pieces of cardboard. The other ready-to-hand valve holder that Wade usually uses is the used head gasket, off the engine being worked on, which has enough head stud and water passage holes for that purpose. But, in this instance, the 356 engine came without a head gasket hence a MBM cardboard setup.

Monday 21st May 2012

Not Wade's Workshop today but pickup of Peter Packard's '38 Packard Twelve. Late yesterday Peter and Ann drove to Sydney, from Canberra, and stayed overnight with Noel. Then this morning I met these three at the habitual rendezvous for Packards heading north out of Sydney, Macca's at Thornleigh. Peter and Ann were in a van complete with tools, just in case. But the van's main purpose was to provide transportation for a large crate containing parts for Peter from the US, notably an R6 Trans and OD and a '37 Super Eight crankshaft, which accompanied the Twelve. From Thornleigh we proceeded to Belmont and met John of Performance Imports who had arranged the shipping, import and clearance of the Twelve into Australia from California. John had imported my Coupe for me back in 2007, so I was returning to familiar territory.

And there it was, sitting in the driveway, in front of John's house with engine running, the Twelve Limousine. Looked magnificent in the sunlight. A very original car, a previous owner being Lionel Barrymore who had it converted to accept a custom wheel chair in lieu of part of the rear seat. See this old thread, Post #4 for a link which references this Lionel Barrymore Packard. Conversion was carried out by Bohman & Schwartz at a cost of over $1800 before WW2. Has been restored with all mechanical components either serviced, replaced or rebuilt, including a full engine rebuild and ready to drive. That suited Peter perfectly because it was his intention to drive the Twelve home to Canberra. This is a distance of about 250 miles and, according to the on-line source I checked, should take about 4 & 1/2 hours for the trip. But before Peter could drive it home, first it needed a safety and mechanical check and certificate. To be followed by a permit from the RMS allowing him to move the Packard from Belmont to Canberra.

Arrived at Ansons Tyre and Auto centre with Noel accompanying Peter in the Twelve while Ann and I followed in our vehicles. Ansons performed the safety and mechanical check and issued the certificate. But not without a minor drama! No, nothing to do with the safety and mechanical check. The Twelve wouldn't start again, after stopping outside, so it could moved inside! But, because Ansons has a sloping driveway running past it, a clutch start cured that problem. It then restarted after being in the building but was cranking over rather slowly. Now fortunately, one of the reasons Noel had made the trip, besides being keen to see the Twelve, was to pick up a shipment of Optima batteries he had imported for PACA members. So 2 of the batteries were loaded into the Twelves boot(trunk), just in case, they might be needed on the next stage of going to the RMS Motor Registry office for the trip permit. At the Registry office the RMS were keen to only issue a 4 hour permit. But Peter was insistent, calling in the manager explaining the age and limitations of the Twelve and that it couldn't be equated to a modern vehicle for trip time purposes, and was able to obtain a 2 day permit. Then, as I was typing this paragraph, I received a call from Noel who had heard from Peter who was about 1/2 an hour away from Canberra and it's now about 6 hours since starting the trip back to Canberra. If you did do that trip in the 4 hour time frame originally offered I'm sure you would be over the speed limit all the way!

After the RMS office, and a bite of lunch, Peter took the opportunity to change out the battery in the Twelve for one of Noel's Optimas because of his concerns as to the health of the battery. Right away it looked a real good move with the Twelve starting right away a couple of times when it was put to the test. Don't worry Lee(Larry51) it wasn't your Optima! Back onto the highway into a service station and filled the Twelve up with 91 Unleaded(no Ethanol). With the gauge indicating about 1/3 full it took about 63 litres, which with some mental gymnastics, assuming the gauge was right, gave me a figure in the vicinity of 96 litres for a full tank. However just checked the 1938 Super 8 and Twelve Owners Manual here on PackardInfo which shows a tank size of 30 gallons or about 120 litres for the Twelve! So either I didn't fill it when I thought I did or the fuel gauge isn't accurate. There you are Peter, I've found a job for you already on the Twelve!

Link to pic's from today.

Getting away from today, I'll backtrack a little to yesterday. Two things. One, I attended a reunion of the Road Knights Hot Rod Club. Two, received an email from BillB. The Road Knights Hot Rod Club? Yes, part of my misspent youth! Turned out Jan, the wife of one member, is a sister of Noel's friend LesF! Was able to tell her I knew Les and had also met her Dad, Neville. Interesting snippet was that her husband always wanted Neville to "steel" his '33 Ford Coupe, because the wood had deteriorated, but Neville just wouldn't do it! And Bill? Here's an excerpt from his email "...Beautiful day up here today took the car to" Macleans Bridge at Lakeside" sponsored by Triumph Club & Shannons. Mainly British cars there but one Packard stood out amongst the Americans. Guy came over to me and gave me his card told me he had taken lots of photo's of my car at the Redlands Australia Day show and that one shot in particular, the mascot, had been downloaded by hundreds around the world. Go to: www.deejay51.com to see some good shots of the car..." So, you too can now view Bill's '37 Convertible Coupe and download pictures!

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Hi all, especially Mal and Noel. Well, after a long and stressful day, made more pleasant with Mal and Noel riding shotgun, we got the 38 Twelve back to Canberra around 8pm, well and truly dark after a 6 hr drive (2 hrs in the dark). The 35/35 Watt headlights do not "cut the mustard" at 60 mph on narrow, twisty, unlit roads, with kangaroos just waiting to play the "chicken" game. In/around Canberra, approximately every third vehicle accident involves a kangaroo. I know that it is very non PC (politically correct), but they are similar to pedestrians and vary in mass from 70 to 300 lbs and can inflict an enormous amount of damage to vehicles, especially to motorcyclists. I have always wanted a Twelve with some provenance and I hope that I now have one. I am hoping to find some "evidence" to prove this vehicle link to Lionel Barrymore and would appreciate it if anyone who has such info could contact me. Meanwhile, I have quite a few items to adjust for the local conditions and Ann and I hope to enjoy the Twelve for many years. We now have the 16th Series almost covered, with examples of a 1600, 1601D, 1603, 1605 and 1608. P. S. I got used to the LHD steering very quickly after about 400 metres when I clipped a gutter. Those 7.50 X 16 Cokers are too d@+#n expensive to scrape! Best regards Peter Toet

Tuesday 22nd May 2012

Yesterday, while yours truely had been away with the Twelve, Wade had been painting parts for the 356 as well as installing the valves, springs, retainers and keepers as well as putting on the tappet covers. He'd also started on the distributor which is what I found him at this morning. Re-assembly of the distributor internal centrifugal weights interspersed with more cleaning of the plate and it's components before it too was re-installed. The re-installation included a set of points of mine which happened to fit, bought off eBay a few years ago. Didn't include the new rotor you gave me yesterday Noel, it was the wrong one, so instead will use the rotor I supplied last week. And Noel, Wade says if you want to change the colour of the vacuum advance that's fine by him, so bring your paintbrush. Although, not "correct", I like the effect the colour gives. I did say I went to a Hot Rod club reunion on Sunday, must still be some of that running through the veins!

Then it was onto having another go at installing the clutch. Relatively easy this time round probably because the replacement clutch fork supplied by Noel last week fitted. The MBM dummy spigot shaft also worked well. The only drawback was it's fondness for falling apart because of it's construction, but that was a minor and not terribly inconvenient hiccup to bear for the utility it provided. Also scrounged up some short bolts from the junk box, the two long ones came with the 356 stuff, and bolted the bottom bellhousing cover on. Although it will have to come off later when the trans is bolted on and the throw-out bearing and spring need to be installed. Also started rounding up enough sump bolts but that turned into a futile exercise. So Noel, looks like you'll have an errand to run to Lee Bros for 2 dozen bolts as well as one long oil pump bolt. Although most oil pump bolts were with the 356 parts there was one short.

Before installing the clutch Wade wanted to reinforce the top of the mobile engine assembly table. To do this outside we went where the business next door has a whole row of stuff along one wall which is rubbish and we were told we could use anything we want. Good, found something with a steel frame perfect for what we wanted. But, when almost back to the workshop, we get pulled up by one of the guys from next door. We can have anything from there BUT not that one thing! Turns out it belongs to some machinery they are trying to sell so it had to go back. Instead found another piece which worked out well. At least they didn't call the law!

While I cleaned up Big Reds valves, Wade turned to cleaning and inspecting the 356's oil pump. Looks excellent but won't be re-assembled until the proper gasket and the necessary bolt are obtained. And Noel, mentioned to Wade about the fuel pump kit so he'll take up on the running for that. Also some clean up of the work area because, with Big Reds engine lying around in pieces, bench space was at a premium. Managed to clear about two half bench tops, but wonder how long that'll last? Then cleaned up Big Reds sump and a few other parts. In addition to taking Big Reds flywheel, clutch, balancer, etc to Tamworth for balancing after the crankshaft is ground Wade will be taking the sump(for cleaning). Apparently they have a real good aluminium parts cleaning process. And new rods have been ordered from the US, but more about those later as there's a 8 week lead time on them.

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Mal, the gasket thickness for the oil pump bottom plate is critical to the pump providing enough pressure. I used a gasket made out of printer paper for the one on my '47's 356. There was a discussion about this some time back. Enjoying the blog. Thanks.

(o[]o)

Wednesday 23rd May 2012

Not a lot of action at the workshop to start with. While Wayne removed the head studs from Big Reds original block I scraped the silicone gasket material off the sump following it's cycle through the parts washer. Wade has decided to see if the original block is salvageable 'cause it's had a lot of work on it. Besides the sleeves there are hardened valve seats, K-liners in the valve guides and new cam bearings. Next week Wade will be taking a load of Big Red engine parts north so Barry's rebuilder has everything necessary for the work he's going to perform.

Also found the bonnet(hood) panel for The Fossil had returned with Steve the panelbeater. But it wasn't ready to go on in fact that's what he was doing, beating the panel. Steve's not happy with it, saying there's a dip in one part, though neither Wade or I can see it, and a very slight kink at one edge, we can see that! Anyway he's going to have another go at the panel tomorrow and when he's happy, Wade'll be happy.

And we were honoured today by not one, but two visits from Noel! The first, Noel brought over the pointer for the timing marks on the harmonic balancer, and left with two requests to fulfill. The hardware to be sourced from Lee Bros and a list of the remaining engine parts Wade needs to finish the 356 assembly. Reason being, Wade would be a lot happier to run the finished engine rather then send back what would essentially be a short block assembly. Noel is happy to accommodate this change of plans. And to be able to do that, when the time comes, the rolling chassis will be trailered over and the engine/trans assembly fitted and fired up. Noel's second visit was unexpected, but it's good he did because with most of the parts from the list, it then kept me busy for the remainder of the afternoon cleaning parts in preparation for painting and further engine assembly.

EDIT - Quote:John,
I remember that thread, for continuing to think of us. An MBM gasket will not be used for such a critical part, instead the correct gasket will be sourced and used.

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Mal,

You can make an oil pump cover gasket easy enough. I think the word of caution is not to use thick gasket material. I made one out of printer paper, and the pump is functioning fine.

Interesting that you had to use a different clutch release lever to get the new clutch installed when the original one obviously fit before. There is a trick to installing the clutch, and I believe it is described in the service manual. I hope the lighter release lever works on the heavy 11" 356 clutch.

Take care,

(o[]o)