Packard Forum Index » V-8 (1955-56)

I am the lucky mushroom who works at home so have no need to commute. Consequently my newest car is now 50 years old. But when business or travel calls I don't give a moment's thought to hopping into a 63 Lark, a 51 200, a 56 Super and knocking off a few hundred miles. I know them all better than the back of my hand and have no problem controlling and stopping them at any speed that can be reached on the east coast. Geez, the Packards are small compared to most pickups.

I do appreciate the quiet and lack of windnoise in new cars but the other tradeoffs are too infuriating to bear: doors that lock when I don't wish them to, abominable visibility, dashboard tops that reflect in the windshield at all times, having to insert my legs into tunnels so that even as a passenger I can't cross my legs on a long trip. And mind-numbing, expensive, and fragile needless complexity. If a car was properly designed, one would not need a backup camera.... OK, enough ranting.

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I was only saying that I would never do it, and was not trying to create an argument about which tire is better.
That said, I don't know how you think that radials last longer. We are told time and time again that radial tires have to be replaced every 5 years. Bias ply tires last a LOT longer than that.

Garaged radial tires can also last a long time. The 67 Corvette had 27 year old Michelins on it when guilt and fear made me replace them. What good is having a Corvette if you're afraid to drive it on a highway over 60 mph? Several family members wouldn't ride in it because they saw violent tire failure as inevitable. Those tires never did let me down.

But I have witnessed several convincing accounts from fellow Packard club members as to the positive effects made by a switch to radials in their 55-56 cars. So be it, and for those lucky enough to have a much older Packard still on bias tires, best wishes to you. A friend still had the original factory tires (and possibly the original East Grand air!) in his father's 1937 Phaeton, the last time I saw it. His late father only drove that car several times a year in town parades and did not see the need for new tires.

Mr. Peterson:

I might certainly be wrong about how long radials last compared to bias plies. When I was in high school in Southern California in the mid 1970s when radials were introduced, there was a lot of arguments about which tire was better; but it quickly became clear which type was superior and in less than 10 years, bias plies had pretty much disappeared, except on the corners of tire racks. As far as how many years a bias ply tire can last; you've got me there. But I do know that in terms of how many miles you can put on a radial tire vs. a bias ply, there is no comparison. Radials in general last about 40,000 miles. I can't remember any bias lasting much more than 20,000. Here is a side by side comparison:

Radial Tire:

Sidewall flex is not transmitted to the tread. The footprint only lengthens. There is little transversal slip The radial tire allows the machine to transfer more power to the ground.

Thanks to the flexibility and strength of the tire, the tire absorbs shocks, impact and bumps. The result is a better ride and better operator comfort.

Bias Ply Tire

All sidewall flex is transmitted to the tread. The footprint deforms and there is an increase in tire slip. The tire does not contact as much ground as a radial tire, leading to a loss of engine power transmission and greater ground damage.

Due to the stiffness of the tire, it does not absorb bumps on the ground. All impact and shaking is felt by the driver and machine.

As a result, radial tires provide:

* Lower fuel consumption.
* Less ground compaction and damage.
* Greater productivity. More of your machines power is actually used.
* Reduction in tire replacement thanks to the longer service life of radial tires.

That is just my 2 cents as far as tires are concerned.

The most critical thing as far as any tire is concerned -- whether bias or radial -- is maintaining proper air pressure and frequent inspections for abnormal wear or damage caused by improper alignment or road damage. I am 100 percent Mr. Peterson will agree with me here!

I do agree with your last statement, 100%. And, because I'm not arguing it one way or the other, I'm not sure I would disagree with anything else you've said.

Just one thing to add: There are not many people putting 40,000 miles on their radial tires within the 5-year time-slot. It seems to me that the argument to put radial tires on is sort of a moot point given that the vehicle will not be driven much more than 2 thousand miles per year... if that.

I REALLY love the feel of the bias ply tires on my One-Eighty, whether i'm on the freeway at 75mph or on a two-laner. And, of course, I like the looks a lot better.
Because it is a Packard, there is absolutely no shaking felt by the driver from bump impact. That is an engineering accomplishment for which Packard spent many dollars and much time perfecting. Even the running boards are cushioned with rubber bushings.

I have to admit, though, that if the pavement is even the slightest bit wet, I drive a LOT slower. ... partially due to the fact that they're about worn out now.

I think the limited lifetime of new tires is not due to whether they are bias or radial ply, but rather the type of material from which they are made. Modern tires are meant to be environmentally friendly and disintegrate over time so as to eliminate the need for the large tire storage piles that create all kinds of problems. Whether radial or bias tires are best for our Packards, I will leave to others to debate.

(o{}o)

This is a great discussion.

If you haven't experienced the old Martin bias ply tires you really don't know how good a bias ply tire can be.

That aside, one thing that will never happen with normal bias ply tires is belt separation. When that happens on a radial the steel belt tears the car apart. So I would opt for bias ply tires on a Packard because of the risk of catastrophic damage running steel belted radials.

I blew a radial on my modern car and the it really made a mess. Fortunately it's all plastic and cheap to replace. On a Packard the fender would have been torn off.

Since 1985, I have driven 1950s-60s Studebaker V8s over 500,000 miles. Over 200,000 of those miles were in Packard V8 powered 1956 Golden Hawks (a.k.a. 56J).

When I lived in the SoCal Desert till the year 2000, on open roads in a favorite 56J, its tac hovered around 2500 RPM. That car literally rolled tens of thousands of miles hovering around 2500 RPM, which was 81 MPH (3 Speed OD with 3.31 rear gears).

Now in Kentucky since 2000, I drive the same car on open roads at around 70 MPH. Just not as wide open here on the east coast. But 80+ was probably too fast in SoCal also. I was just younger & dumber then.

Early on, in 1985 I swapped radials onto a Stude Hawk, and never looked back at polys. Anyone who has ever done an actual, behind the wheel comparison knows why.

Just my experience. Yours may vary.

Joe H.
Just out of curiosity how did u hooked on the 56J's???
I got into Packard by serendipity and just never stopped.

PackardV8,
It was in the late 1960s, coming up on my 16th birthday and in prep for drivers license. For several months, my dad & I had been looking in used car lots. I had looked at many cars, but nothing really tickled my fancy. Then one day we stopped at a lot and I spotted a black 56J from afar. Even while still 50 feet away from it I was liking it. By the time I'd gotten close enough to peer into the window, I had fallen in love. Long story short, we bought the car for $250, and I drove it most of my high school years. Its been a love affair with 56Js ever since. I have owned about a dozen of them now, and about half of them were drivers, and the rest parts cars or resto projects I passed on to someone else.
I hope to have a 56J sitting in the garage when I leave this world, even if its 50 years from now :)