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Gents,

My '41 110 Club Coupe recently had the transmission entirely rebuilt with NOS parts. Despite having replaced a significant amount of the linkages and parts of the column shift mechanism, the gear shifter is still somewhat vague and sloppy (by modern standards) which results in a fair amount of slop when seeking the neutral "channel" to go from 1st to 2nd.

You can imagine the sick feeling I got when, right after getting the car back from the tranny shop, I went to shift from 1st to 2nd and caught the edge of reverse, with the sickening "buzz"! This has since happened 3 or 4 times and I have to be very careful and ginger when moving the shifter up and into the neutral gate. It seems if I go 1/4" higher then level, I touch reverse and get the buzz.

I have 4 questions for the board:

1. What damage, if any, is/has occurred from these momentary contacts with reverse. At no time has the car actually gone into reverse and I have immediately backed off the stick the instant I felt and heard the contact.

2. Should I replace the tranny fluid in case metal filings have been generated form this contact and are now circulating throughout the gearbox?

3. What type of transmission fluid is correct and in what quantity? Is synthetic recommended?

4. What is the best way to adjust the column shift mechanism so that I have more clearance from inadvertently touching reverse? Ideally, I would like reverse to engage only at the top of a long, deliberate stroke on the shifter and it seems it is beginning to engage very close off the shifter lever being horizontal in the neutral slot.

Thank you all very much !

Having just "de-slopified" a 1941 110 a few weeks ago, this is all pretty fresh in my memory. I may not be able to answer all of your questions, but I have a pretty good understanding of how the entire linkage system works.

If you're interested in a good explanation and deep dive into the issues Packard experienced with the Handishift system, check out the Packard Club Cormorant Magazine issue from the winter of 1971, page 22. Bud Juneau (still an active member of the club) wrote a great article called "The Not-So-Handy-Handishift."

In order:

1) You likely haven't done any real damage, provided you haven't forced it into reverse. If you've just "clipped" reverse when coming from 1st, keep in mind you're moving relatively slowly, the most you've probably done is just wear a little bit of the edges of the gear teeth down. It's not something I'd made a habit of, but the few times you've clipped reverse, it probably hasn't done any more damage than would be done by not being completely stopped when going into 1st, etc. But this is all subjective. The only way to know is to pull the transmission apart, which, unless you are now experiencing trouble with using reverse, would be complete overkill.

2) A transmission oil change couldn't hurt. You'll turn a "known unknown" into a "known known." Wouldn't you rather, having just spent all that money on a rebuild, KNOW the fluid is clean? You or someone will be under there anyway fiddling with the linkage, why not change it? Cheap insurance.

3) Synthetic is not recommended. SAE 140 GL4 gear oil is appropriate in warm weather. The owners manual recommended SAE 140 in summer, SAE 90 in winter, SAE 80 in extremely cold weather. Depending on how the transmission was rebuilt, it may be possible to use a GL4/GL5 multi-weight oil, such as a 85W-140, but GL5 doesn't protect yellow metals (think synchros) well, so ask your rebuilder what they recommend.

4) There is no way to adjust where reverse is, at least not in the way I think you want to. You can adjust where neutral falls on the column, but that adjusts where all the other shift points are on the lever. The distance between the detents, though, is fixed by the levers on the transmission and the way the transmission itself is manufactured.

There are two shift forks at the base of the column, one controls reverse and 1st, the other controls 2nd and 3rd. Each fork is connected through a system of turnbuckles, pivots, and rods to the levers on the side of the transmission. When the lever is pulled forward, the transmission is in one gear, when it's pushed backward, it's in the other gear controlled by that fork. When it's in the straight up/down position, that section is in neutral. The interlock block prevents the transmission (theoretically) from being in two gears at once, so one lever has to be in the neutral position before the other lever can be moved forward or back.

The distance the levers on the transmission move governs the amount travel the shifter on the column can do. I may not be explaining it clearly, but basically, the only adjustment you have is in the length of the linkage rods. No matter how short or long the rods are, the ultimate length of travel of the system within gears controlled by the same fork is fixed.

Now, of course, that doesn't answer your ultimate question, which is, "how can I fix this properly?"

The answer lies in eliminating the side to side motion of the linkage and removing slop and lost motion. Before you start, lock the two forks together at the base of the steering column with a 3/16" rod or drill bit. Then check each pivot point. The clevis pins should be tight in their holes, the rods themselves shouldn't be able to move side to side at all. Disconnect each connection point and insert thin flat washers between the walls of the lever ends, such that when the clevis pin is installed and the cotter pin is replaced at each connection, the linkage can't move side-to-side. There are, I think, three places on each rod system to check for slop. If the clevis doesn't fit tightly through the holes, you'll need to fashion or find a bushing insert to narrow the holes a bit. If you find spring washers or wave washers, throw them away -- they introduce slop and the factory told everyone to remove them.

If you find that there is no side to side motion of the linkage down below, then you've just got a minor adjustment issue with where the rods connect to the forks at the base of the steering column. Though, usually, when these are mis-adjusted you'll get the thing stuck in multiple gears at once rather than clipping the other gear.

In my experience, having done this twice on two different cars in the last few weeks, removing the slop in the linkage, especially side-to-side motion, and then adjusting the rods so that they are perfectly equal up top where they insert into the forks, gets these things shifting near perfectly.

There are several service bulletins on this in the service index, many of which have pictures explaining how the linkage works and how to adjust it.

I should mention, though, that usually 1st and 3rd are the ones with short travel, reverse and 2nd are the ones with long travel. You should come out of first with very little travel of the shifter up to neutral, at which point, if you let go of the shifter, it should spring forward (toward the front of the car) onto the 2nd/3rd fork, at which point you should then be able to upshift.

Nice write up! Thanks!

... but GL5 doesn't protect yellow metals (think synchros

DrewLA, that was a legitimate concern many years ago with EP gear oils that depended on so-called "SCL" additives (sulfo-chloro-lead) for the EP or extreme pressure characteristics but today's GL-5 multi-vis EP gear oils are compatible with yellow metals. I make this statement based on personal experience over the last 20 or so years so perhaps a check of the specs or with tech specialists of major gear oil manufacturers would be appropriate.

Hello Ragtime:

Drew gave you some good advice there. If you want to read more, then check out this thread:https://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6106&viewmode=flat&order=ASC&type=&mode=0&start=0

If I were in your shoes, then I would start with the shifter levers at the base of the steering column. I had the same issue with my 1941 160 when I found out that my levers were worn out. I was getting ready to reproduce them until Fred Kanter said they had a large stock of NOS parts. My shifter lever part numbers were 360425 (R & 1st) and 360426 (2nd & 3rd) - you may want to double check the parts book to see if those numbers are also good for your 110. Anyway, Kanter had them for $66 each at the time and they did the trick.

You may already know this, but you should use a definite H pattern as you shift gears. Mine used to hang-up/freeze going from 1st to 2nd until I started making the H pattern. When going from 1st and passing neutral (palm of your hand up) take a second and move the shifter deliberately through the middle of the H (now palm down). Then lift the shifter into 2nd. The chance of a hang-up greatly increases if you use your palm down for the entire sequence and try to slide through the middle of the H pattern

Good Luck.

Roger gives excellent advice in his last paragraph and even with worn and sloppy linkages following it can very much minimize the "hanging" up problem. A friend with a 41 LeBaron had constant problems with "stuck in 1st; it was a bit like teaching a stone to speak but when I finally got the message thru to him it pretty much ended 90% of his problems.

R-K; don't forget to check the levers on the transmission, there are balls and springs that prevent your problem. if you take the linkage off the trans levers and push the rear to the back(reverse)the front lever should not move, if it moves you need to take the cover off and check the detentes.

Don't forget to oil the levers on the column. There is a small hole on the shaft just above the levers.

(o{}o)

Quote:

And I believe the shift tube and lever setup is similar to the Clippers in as much as oil in the small hole does not do much in reaching the upper 2-3 lever unless some spilled while trying to get into the hole. Both levers need to be free to rotate on the shift tube. The upper lever has no direct lube point so is frequently dry. Place a few drops of oil at the top of lever so it can run down in the space between the lever and shift tube.

Thank you all so much for the thoughtful and very helpful responses! I really appreciate it.

DrewLA, your description exactly matches what I've got on my hands and thanks to the great detail you provided, I spent several hours today taking all the linkages in the assembly apart and cleaning them up.

As you suspected, there were spring washers in every joint and a large amount of side-to-side play at each connection. Tomorrow I will remove the spring washers and take up all the gap with additional metal washers to remove all that slop. I also found one of the bellcranks had a bronze bushing at the center that was worn obong and rocked side-to-side on the post it rotates on. I drilled that out and resleeved it with a new bronze bushing from the hardware store and now it sits straight and rotates freely on its shaft, so that ought to help.

I'm still not entirely clear on how best to move the reverse engagement point as far away from neutral as I can but suspect I can accomplish this by shortening the turnbuckle connecting the bellcrank to that 1st-Reverse shift fork.

My understanding is that if the two castings on the steering column rod are lined up perfectly straight (using the 3/16" drill-bit as a guide) and with the shift lever perfectly horizontal on the steering wheel, the transmission should be in neutral. Starting from this reference point, if I screw in the turnbuckle connecting the 1st-3rd bellcrank to the shift fork on the transmission, I am moving 1st gear slightly closer to neutral and 3rd gear the same amount farther away from neutral.

If that is correct, would it make sense to bias it this way so as to allow myself a margin of safety when going through the H-pattern from 1st to 2nd so as to avoid inadvertent contact with reverse in case I move slightly too far up during the motion?