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Does anybody have information on Packard based racing cars of the mid to late 30's era. Specifically I am hoping to find out about single or two seater, open wheeled cars that may have run in road, circuit, speed or oval track events using the S8 engine. I am currently looking at taking on such a project and would appreciate any information or photos that you may have. Many thanks in advance. Matt.

G'day Matt,
Great to onboard another member from down-under. Don't have any specific info on racing Packards of the late 30's but these could help you:

Ron's '28 Speedster Project

Eric's Packard Barchetta Speedster Project

And a question for you. Are you a member of The Packard Automobile Club of Australia(PACA)?

Thanks for the welcome & the info Mal. Not a member of the Club yet - but will be if I go ahead with this project as I hope. Still in the research stage at this point.

Don't know of any from the 30s but there were some Packard racers in the 20s

Postcard of 1923 Indy racer

moodyscollectibles.com/postcard-news/?p=657

Ralph DePalma on Wikipedia with Packard V12 record holder and Indy racer pics

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_DePalma

Snapey


Packard's factory auto racing days, such as they were ended in the early 1920's after a less than lackluster showing at Indianapolis-1922 or 1923. Jesse Vincent had developed interests in airplanes and speedboats by this time. Packard did considerable business in aviation and marine engines for a number of years. This was a bigger market than performance cars in this country at the juncture, so Packard's somewhat limited resources were spent on the planes and boats. Jesse Vincent did have one speedster built but it lived on the Proving Grounds. There was a limited run of Speedster derived cars built in 1929 and 1930, but they were not even advertised.

Competition was left to the specialists in the 20's-Miller and Duesenberg. Races where held on closed dirt and wood tracks, so the cars were specialized and not suitable for road work. Roads in most places will still marginal to nonexistent. European roads were less primitive and had less traffic to run into with a fast car. When a Duesenberg won the French Grand Prix in 1921 the French were so incensed that they did not play the American anthem for the winners and barely spoke to them.


The advent of the Depression killed the Millers and Duesenbergs and led to the "junk" formula, modification of production cars. Fords, Buicks and Studebakers seemed to be the preferred platforms. Road racing and such waited until after the war in this country,

So, no Super 8 hot rods or Bentley eaters....Alvan Macauley would have been aghast anyway.

Regards

John Harley

Snapey

I was negligent in not mentioning that this is covered in the excellent book, Packards at Speed, by Robert Neal, who is a member of this list


Regards


John Harley

John,
Thank you very much for your excellent reply and information - and what you have said confirms what I have learnt from the limited web based research that I have been able to do so far. I take it from this, then, that motorsport in the US was somewhat different during the pre and immediately post war years than it was here in Australia. Here we seem to have a relative wealth of unique 'home built' specials that were often cut down, weight reduced or re-engined versions of more common cars. They were most often built by individuals who simply wanted to create a car that they could race as cheaply as possible. Given the huge auto manufacturing industry in the US I guess it is not surprising that the big car companies created their own racing cars for testing and promotion. This may have left little room for the 'backyarder' who was able to shoehorn a flat head V8 along with the Morris bits that he had sitting under the house into a narrowed MG chassis.

I was, however, hoping that there would be some occurence of this sort of thing that involved Packard components that might be recorded. Perhaps given the cost of a Packard in their day this is less likely - although I do know of similar cars. I believe it was in 1937 that a gentleman named Oldfield ran a V16 Marmon engined special in qualifying at the Brickyard. It was not a pretty car to look at and did not qualify for the race (due to mechanical problems?), but the concept was brilliant - and if I thought there was a chance of finding such an engine and the other components within my rather tight budget then it would be a fabulous car to 'recreate'.

But I still find that I am drawn by the Packard marque and hope that if you, or anyone else, are able to dredge up any memories or references to such a car then I would be very appreciative.

Also, I am very interested in obtaining/reading Robert Neals book and if somebody has a copy they are willing to part with, could you please let me know.

Regards

Matt Snape

Snapey, Robert Neal's book: "Packards at Speed" is still in print and can be purchased from more than one source. I found mine at T.E. Warth, Esq. Automotive Books, 1830A Hanley Rd., P.O. Box 1617, Hudson, WI 54016 USA, 715-381-7248, info@twwarthautobucks.biz. It is also available from the publisher Aero-Marine History, but I do not have their address information. It is a book worth having in your library. Also, look at the review in the Packard Bookshelf section on this website.

I second John's comment on Bob Neal's book Packards at Speed, and say the same about his Master Motor Builders, also a great addition to any Packard library. You can find short reviews of both books on this website's Bookshelf. Anxiously awaiting his next book on the 48-50 Packards.

Wade's come to the party with Robert Neal's Packards at Speed book. See this post in the Wade's Workshop blog.