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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#11
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HH56
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The barb fittings on the pump would definitely be easier and the only difference to the way it was later done by Packard is their pump hose connections were actually small nipples in ports cast as part of the pump housing and not thread ins.

On the horizontal tube run, it was 1/4 in steel tubing. I see one of the special port plugs with a stud end that is on the longitudinal oil gallery. That one is located just forward of the crankcase vent tube. If there is another simiar plug or maybe something with an ordinary bolt hole closer to the pump the horizontal tubing was supported by loop type tube clamps. The ones on the gallery plugs had legs 2 or 3 inches long. The hole in the clamp legs went over the stud and was held by a nut and washer. The legs were bent in such a way as to position the tubing closer to the block laying in the void just above the oil gallery. At the firewall end it was bent upward. Since you have the tube on the firewall then a few inches of rubber hose would be the connection.

Posted on: 3/24 13:13
Howard
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#12
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Packard Don
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I can't speak for 22nd and 23rd series cars, but 1951 through 1954 were the same with short rubber hoses and push-on fittings at the pump and the vacuum booster section was at the top. No flares involved but the fittings on the housing were pressed in brass or copper, not cast as part of the housing.

Posted on: 3/24 13:38
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#13
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HH56
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Don is correct. I should have said "small nipples in port HOLES cast as part of the pump housing". The way I worded it would lead you to believe the nipples were physically an actual part of the casting. Not so but I also don't remember them as being brass however it is a long time since I looked at one of those pumps so he is probably correct there too..

Posted on: 3/24 14:02
Howard
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#14
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Ozstatman
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Joe,
but be aware the lower radiator hose shown in this picture, unless it is the reinforced type, could be subject to failure.

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EDIT - Sorry Joe should have addressed my post to Bob J.

Posted on: 3/24 16:52
Mal
/o[]o\
====

Bowral, Southern Highlands of NSW, Australia
"Out of chaos comes order" - Nietzsche.

1938 Eight Touring Sedan - SOLD

1941 One-Twenty Club Coupe - SOLD

1948 Super Eight Limo, chassis RHD - SOLD

1950 Eight Touring Sedan - SOLD

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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#15
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Bob J
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No worries, it is.
Bob J.

Posted on: 3/24 18:26
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#16
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Packard Don
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Here’s a view of them (left side) on a pump that I recently rebuilt for my 1951. They might be copper but I'm not sure.

As far as the lower radiator hose is concerned, I believe it should be a steel pipe with short rubber hoses to connect it on either end.

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Posted on: 3/24 19:08
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#17
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Joe
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Guys, thank you so much! Many curiosities solved here. I've seen those studs/nuts and always wondered. I just sort of assumed that someone had put them there because they didn't have a proper plug. Makes much more sense now. I'll track down some parts and get this all strung back together. I'll post a picture of the solution once I get it wrapped up (some time next week). Thanks again!

Posted on: 3/24 20:34
Joe B.
Greenville, NC
1950 Super Deluxe Eight Touring Sedan, Model 2302-5
327 w/ Ultramatic, 6v+
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#18
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Alrighty, got installed my best guess for how this stuff was run. I would assume that it was a fitted connection at the pump, just given that there isn't room to attach 90° fittings. So, I ended up running a rubber line from the pump to the opening on the heat shield, connected to a 1/4" steel tube (brake line that I wrapped in high heat insulatiom) that I ran to the back of the block. I only had one of of those studs for a loop clamp, so that's the only spot it's attached to the block. From there, I put a small bend in the line so it could more easily connect to the next run of steel tube. Onward and upward from there.

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Posted on: 3/31 23:48
Joe B.
Greenville, NC
1950 Super Deluxe Eight Touring Sedan, Model 2302-5
327 w/ Ultramatic, 6v+
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#19
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Packard Don
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It looks close although no clamps originally or if there were any, they were the flat spring type. They need be only a little snug, unlike a fuel or other lines carrying liquid under pressure. The fuel line is a bit off, though, as it had originally a 90 aiming out. In this photo is visible one of the original bolts with holes for wires to keep them from working loose due to the Phenolic washer that will break if tightened too much.

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Posted on: Yesterday 2:10
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Re: ISO - 31.386174 Tube-Cleaner Vacuum
#20
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HH56
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Your best guess is pretty good on the vacuum tubing and that looks to be a nice neat routing much like Packard would have done. Only minor differences are in the hose clamps and tube supports. The tube support clamps had longer legs so raised the tubing a bit higher but those were special items and doubt they would be easy to find today so yours are perfectly serviceable.

Don mentioned the hose clamps as not being the type used and he is correct. Most wiper, washer, and vacuum antenna related hoses did not have clamps at all -- just relied on a snug fit to the metal tubing or port connections. I believe the only postwar clamps Packard used on a vacuum line or hose started in 52 with the power brake hoses.

From a previous discussion it was mentioned that possibly there was a fudge factor in hose sizes available then as they fit more snugly over the metal tubing. Todays 1/4 hose is a true size and a bit loose so modern 7/32 vacuum hose provides the better snug fit. If you used that smaller size you could get away with no clamps but if you used actual 1/4 hose then you probably do need clamps to prevent small vacuum leaks.

The single loop wire clamp where you need pliers to squeeze the ends together to open the loop and slip it over the hose or connection is what Packard would have used but the screw types work well -- although if you go for judging at a meet they might get called out by a judge who knows Packards.

Click to see original Image in a new window

Posted on: Yesterday 10:58
Howard
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